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m31195
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 21st, 2007 |
| Location: | Oakland, California USA |
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| First Name: | Gator | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Baptist, Christian reformed |
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Posted: Fri Sep 21st, 2007 10:30 pm |
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Is it proper for a non catholic inquirer to attend Mass? Are there any things I should know before I go? I have only attended a Mass one time in my life and don't remember much, since it was so long ago.
Gator
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Credo Catholic
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Posted: Fri Sep 21st, 2007 10:49 pm |
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| It's always proper for a person to enter God's house in worship. The catholic church invites inquirers and visitors as long as they are sincerely there to worship Him. In general, you can follow along with what everyone else is doing. There will be a small book in the pew rack called a missal or missalette, organized by dates, that will help you to follow the order of the mass. You can kneel with the others, stand with them, and listen. The only thing you can't do is receive the Holy Eucharist, or Communion. That is reserved for members of the catholic church, who are in "full communion with the church." Some of our forum members are good at supplying links to websites that teach about the mass. Maybe someone will give you a place to look, to see what the order of the mass is, what it means, etc.
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CajunRick
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Posted: Sat Sep 22nd, 2007 12:32 pm |
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m31195 wrote: Is it proper for a non catholic inquirer to attend Mass? Are there any things I should know before I go? I have only attended a Mass one time in my life and don't remember much, since it was so long ago.
One of my favorite gathering songs is "All Are Welcome". The principle line of the refrain is, "All are welcome in this place".
Many people who are new to attending mass are often more comfortable sitting in the back so they can observe what other people are doing, and not feel like everyone is watching them. The unfortunate thing is that you can't see what's going on at the altar very well, and in many churches you can't hear very well either. I was raised Catholic so I can't identify with the experience of being at mass the first time, but I have attended other churches, so I know a little of what it's like.
When I visit a Catholic church of a different rite for the first time, I always contact them ahead of time and ask if I can meet someone before mass to get acclimated. Perhaps the parish church you will visit will have someone willing to join you for your first mass so you won't be a complete stranger. Then, after mass, maybe they can join you for coffee and answer any questions while they are fresh in your mind. The mass is so rich that you will probably still be noticing things for years, and every motion and sound has meaning and symbolism behind it.
Otherwise, if I were you, I wouldn't really try to follow what's going on at all the first time. Just take it all in. You can stand and sit and kneel with everyone else, or not. Be aware of what others around you are doing, though. If you decide to sit when they kneel, try to sit forward in the seat so those behind you are not too uncomfortable. At communion, maybe you can sit at the end of the pew so that you can get out to let the others out for communion. After mass (or ahead of time, if you have an opportunity), ask if you can borrow a missalette so you can begin to familiarize yourself with it, even if it is an old one. The mass itself does not change from week to week, but the prayers and scripture readings do. An old missalette can help you to understand the structure of the unchangeable parts.
Above all else, praise God. You probably won't know the songs and prayers, so just listen. Enjoy the experience, and remember that from the moment you walk in until the moment you walk out, you are in the presence of Jesus Christ in the Body and the Blood, so act accordingly. "All are welcome in this place."
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Darlene
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Posted: Sat Sep 22nd, 2007 02:15 pm |
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CajunRick wrote:
One of my favorite gathering songs is "All Are Welcome". The principle line of the refrain is, "All are welcome in this place".
Rick,
I don't think I've ever heard that one before at a Catholic mass. However, I remember singing a simple praise chorus at various Protestant churches that went like this:
Holy Spirit thou art welcome in this place
Holy Spirit thou art welcome in this place
Omnipent Father of mercy and grace
Thou art welcome in this place.
We do need to welcome each other and the Blessed Triune God when we come to worship together. When I pray the second joyful mystery of the Rosary, The Visitation, I often ask Jesus to make me willing and ready to welcome Him into my home and my heart at all times. I love this particular mystery because it takes me back to that moment when John the Baptist, even though just a babe in the womb, recognized the Messiah when he entered their home. And Elizabeth also, in union with John the Baptist, recognized immediately that Mary her cousin, was the mother of her Lord. And she immediately welcomed her cousin into her home.
I would love to hear a sermon/homily on this passage of scripture. Sadly, I never heard a sermon preached on this particular passage that I can recall.
Darlene
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The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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prayingforanswers
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Posted: Sun Oct 7th, 2007 09:27 pm |
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I am not Catholic, but I have been attending mass with my husband and children for sixteen years, and I have always been welcomed. I stand, sit, and kneel along with everyone else, but I just began kneeling a few years ago. I always sat during communion while everyone else went to the front, but after my daughter received her first communion last year, our priest said I could come forward and place my arms across my chest during communion in order to just be blessed by him. I was uncomfortable with this at first, but now it does not bother me. I am currently enrolled in an RCIA class to find out more about the church. I am hoping to finally join the church at Easter. I was surprised to find out how many people who attend my church have not formally joined! I had never noticed this. Please do not worry about standing out--I've been going to church for so long that many people are surprised to find out that I am not actually Catholic! Most people are very understanding and want to welcome you.
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jessef
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Posted: Wed Oct 24th, 2007 11:15 pm |
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| Don't be nervous and I am sure that you will be welcomed when you go! I always felt welcomed when I first started going.
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Michelle1982
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Posted: Wed Dec 12th, 2007 03:50 am |
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Of course it's proper. It's God's house and the church that He established on this earth. It might be a little different than our protestant services. But you will get used to it and eventually grow to love it.
However, in my humble opinion, (I myself am converting to Catholocism from protestantism) be careful whom you are telling that you are going to Catholic mass.
I don't say this to be a liar. There is just no need to advertise and cause unnecessary conflict with other brothers and sisters in Christ. If they ask you, tell the truth. But make sure that you are discerning God's voice in all of this. I say this to you because I noticed that you come from a Christian reformed church. I know first hand how brutal toward the Catholic church that some of them can be. I live with a PCA(reformed presbyerian) family.
When I was searching in the Catholic church, I started reading Catholic books. I never told the family what I was doing though. One day though, her husband saw a Mother Theresa book that I had. He told me that Mother Theresa was going to hell because she believed that all faiths led to heaven. What I am trying to say is, when it comes to Catholocism, talk to Catholics or other people who are also converting. You might get confused if you listen too much to your other protestant friends.
Anyways, I can't remember where I was going with that. But, pray, pray, and be in Your Bible. The Lord will show You the truth. But keep an open mind. When you read a Catholic book, read it with a open mind and not a (narrow minded reformed mind.)
Forgive my rudeness. I will be praying for you!
Michelle
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"..............From everyone who has been given much, much will be required; and to whom they entrusted much, of him they will ask all the more." Luke 12:48
"You will seek Me and find Me when you search for Me with all your heart." J
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catholic
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Posted: Sun Dec 16th, 2007 12:01 am |
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CajunRick wrote:
When I visit a Catholic church of a different rite for the first time, I always contact them ahead of time and ask if I can meet someone before mass to get acclimated. Perhaps the parish church you will visit will have someone willing to join you for your first mass so you won't be a complete stranger. Then, after mass, maybe they can join you for coffee and answer any questions while they are fresh in your mind. The mass is so rich that you will probably still be noticing things for years, and every motion and sound has meaning and symbolism behind it.
That is a great idea. I have done that too. I am blessed to have Byzantine http://home.catholicweb.com/johnchrysostom/index.cfm (Ruthenian) Catholic and Melkite http://www.melkite.org/P-Columbus.html Catholic Parishes nearby. I also live near a Latin Rite Parish which hosts a Maronite mission http://www.ourladyoflebanon.info/ and liturgy.
The Melkite Parish was very accommodating. The cantor spent time with us explaining pretty much everything for us. The Byzantine Parish has the same liturgy (Divine liturgy of St. John Chrysostom) so it is pretty much the same as the Melkite divine liturgy. The Maronite liturgy was nearly the same as the latin Rite Mass.
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abbycat
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Posted: Tue Jan 29th, 2008 04:41 pm |
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Oh my ... I don't want to be an irritant here, but this is one of those things that really digs deeply within me. If I, as a Protestant attend Mass, and am not able to participate in Communion, it is as if I am not welcome. If I truly know Christ as my Saviour and Lord, and have a genuine and faithful walk with Him, as only He could know I realize, to be refused the Eucharist is just extremely sad to me.
abby
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Annie
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Posted: Tue Jan 29th, 2008 04:53 pm |
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abbycat wrote: Oh my ... I don't want to be an irritant here, but this is one of those things that really digs deeply within me. If I, as a Protestant attend Mass, and am not able to participate in Communion, it is as if I am not welcome. If I truly know Christ as my Saviour and Lord, and have a genuine and faithful walk with Him, as only He could know I realize, to be refused the Eucharist is just extremely sad to me.
abby
Yes, it is sad that the Protestants threw away belief in the Real Presence and the re-presentation at Mass of the sacrifice of Calvary (a window opens in Eternity and we are there). It is not the individual's relationship with Christ that matters here (that being the inward-looking Protestant focus) but the knowledge that He is present on the altar, Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity. When you (the generic you, not the specific you) can participate in Eucharistic Adoration and barely be able to gaze upon Christ because of a knowledge of your own inadequacy, then you will have a taste of what the Real Presence means.
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Annie
Ora et labora
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Intercessor
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Posted: Tue Jan 29th, 2008 05:10 pm |
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Abby, take a look at the posts in this older thread.
You'll see that I once shared your feelings.
Click here to see what others on this forum have said about Receiving.
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"The perfection of a soul may be measured by the degree to which it does the will of God, and finds its happiness in doing it.... O my God,...the only thing necessary is Your holy will," Divine Intimacy, pp. 15-16 Father Gabriel, O.C.D.
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Annie
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Posted: Tue Jan 29th, 2008 05:32 pm |
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That is one of the best threads that has ever been on this forum I think.
beliefnet has had some interesting discussions on this subject too.
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Annie
Ora et labora
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abbycat
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Posted: Tue Jan 29th, 2008 11:58 pm |
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Hi Annie ... thank you for replying to my post. I do have to share with you, however, that it is this type of statement that makes many Protestants believe that we, somehow, just don't measure up to standards. I know you probably do not mean it that way, but perhaps there is a more gentle way of putting it ... it sounds rather like "you just don't understand Christ's Presence ... maybe someday you will and then you will be as good as us." Admittedly, we perhaps see the Eucharist somewhat differently at this point, you seeing it as the true Body and Blood of Christ, and I , at present, seeing it as it being more symbolic ... but there may be a less judgmental way of stating it.
Just a thought ...
abby
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Credo Catholic
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 12:19 am |
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Hi Abby,
Pretty much everyone who has ever converted from protestantism to catholicism has had the same feeling you are having. I have read over and over here on the forum of people who have been insulted by not being allowed to receive the Eucharist at mass. I myself went through stages of insult, hurt, misbelieving and envy, just to name a few off the top of my head. It was the conviction in my head and heart that the Eucharist was the true Body and Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ that kept me coming back week after week to complete RCIA so I could receive the Eucharist. I felt at times that the RCC was holding the Lord kidnapped, that the world belonged to Him, not just the catholics. But, and there's always a but, I learned why the church does this, and it's not to turn people away or make them feel less Christian. The catholic church truly wants everyone to be in communion with them. But the world is not in communion. You say yourself that you still believe communion is a symbol. The church believes it has a duty, as custodian and defender of the deposit of faith, not to hand out the true and real body of Christ to anyone who does not publicly profess that His presence is real. By publicly professing I mean joining the RCC or one of the other catholic churches in communion with Rome. And it's not over and done even then. If a practicing catholic has committed a sin and not been to confession, they are not in a state of grace and are not permitted to receive until they do make confession. This is hard to accept, and I understand where you are coming from. Maybe one of the moderators can explain it better, but one thing I have learned: whether or not we understand it, the church always has an excellent reason for what she does. She holds true and fast to her doctrines and teachings whether we like them or not!
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Annie
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 02:37 pm |
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abbycat wrote: Hi Annie ... thank you for replying to my post. I do have to share with you, however, that it is this type of statement that makes many Protestants believe that we, somehow, just don't measure up to standards. I know you probably do not mean it that way, but perhaps there is a more gentle way of putting it ... it sounds rather like "you just don't understand Christ's Presence ... maybe someday you will and then you will be as good as us." Admittedly, we perhaps see the Eucharist somewhat differently at this point, you seeing it as the true Body and Blood of Christ, and I , at present, seeing it as it being more symbolic ... but there may be a less judgmental way of stating it.
Just a thought ...
abby
Sorry, but the Church herself is VERY judgmental on this point. That is why it is a mortal sin to take communion illicitly. There is a vast difference in understanding of the communion between Catholic and Protestant. beliefnet has extensive discussions on this, including many posts by people who simply go to a parish where they are not known and take communion illicitly anyway. There is no "non-judgmental" way of stating the Church's position on this matter. The concept of "non-judgmental" doesn't compute in Catholic land in matters of theology and practice.
Even an important person like Tony Blair would have had to confess taking communion illicitly before he joined the Church if he knew it was outlawed when he was doing it.
____________________
Annie
Ora et labora
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EMarshallBuckles
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 03:13 pm |
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It should also be noted that Catholics do not participate in Holy Communion at Protestant churches and I understand why of course.
I often watch the Daily Mass on EWTN. They have a prayer for those who cannot receive while those present at the Mass in Irondale, AL at their chapel recieve. I don't have the text just now, however, as memory serves, it states something to the effect that "...while I cannot receive You[Jesus] at this time, I desire to do so and ask you to come into my heart, just now, forgive me, heal me, bless me..." and so forth. It's always a touching prayer and one which a Protestant could pray when attending Mass. I also noticed, for the first time today, that one man coming forth crossed his arms to receive a blessing. Due to the camera angle, I couldn't see what Father Anthony did, however, it looked as though he blessed the man. I inquired at some of our local Catholic Churches[including the Cathedral of the Sacred Heart], via email to ask about whether they give blessings to those who cannot receive for some reason, and they said that, yes, they do and that I would always be welcome to come forward to receive a blessing.
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Credo Catholic
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 04:00 pm |
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| After re-reading the last few posts regarding non-catholics receiving the Eucharist, it dawned on me why Jesus referred to Peter as the rock on which the church is built. The rock holds steadfast even when everything else is swirling around. It doesn't budge. That's not stubbornness or judgemental, it's rock solid truth that doesn't change with the times. The church is being judged for being what Christ said it would be!
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abbycat
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 08:19 pm |
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OK ... I get it. Guess I'll stay in my Lutheran church where all who profess to know Christ as their Lord and Savior (only God knows their hearts for sure), are welcome to receive Communion.
abby
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Intercessor
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 08:44 pm |
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 Hey, wait a sec, Abby. (Hope you read the thread I listed above.)
I really do know what you're feeling. I had the same feelings exactly.
Here's the thing. Maybe you're coming at this from the wrong angle.
Instead of focusing on how you want Communion managed, why not focus on how the Holy Spirit is leading you?
I'm excited about your presence here on the forum and believe you are a sincere, godly lady wanting to do the right thing. Here's a suggestion:
Try praying, throughout the day, from now on, that the Holy Spirit will lead you to the Truth. He is Truth, you know. I remember praying that and being scared to death that He was going to show me that the Catholic Church was the one true Church and that I should embrace her.
Is that quiet voice inside you prompting you toward the Catholic faith?
I think it is. Try telling God you will follow the Truth, whatever it is, but that you really want to be led to the Truth. Hold off on making upfront demands about how His Church should handle specific matters. First things first.
Don't give up on us too soon, Abby. The folks here are really loving, wonderful folks. Some of us just smart a bit sometimes because we have feelings, too, and have suffered much abuse from friends, family, and strangers about our Catholic beliefs.
Let's be patient and forbearing and search for Truth.
That's what matters.
Much love in Christ, dear lady,
BeckyLast edited on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 08:49 pm by Intercessor
____________________
"The perfection of a soul may be measured by the degree to which it does the will of God, and finds its happiness in doing it.... O my God,...the only thing necessary is Your holy will," Divine Intimacy, pp. 15-16 Father Gabriel, O.C.D.
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Credo Catholic
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 09:59 pm |
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| Abby, I'm feeling pretty bummed out that you are feeling bummed out. I wish I knew a better way to explain it so you would see it the way we do. I don't always express things in the most clear way. I hope before making that decision to stay Lutheran, you will take the time to look at the big picture. Intercessor explained it in the thread she posted the link to above, as a lesson in humility, and I understood exactly what she meant. While I was attending RCIA and waiting to join the catholic church, which I later found out I didn't even have to do, since I'd already been baptised, I went to mass and received a blessing instead of the Eucharist. For seven months I did that, and during that time I learned the importance of the Eucharist from a catholic understanding. And it is different, it really is. I hope you will give it some more thought, and maybe attend an hour of Adoration at a parish near you. We really want you to stay. God bless
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abbycat
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 11:05 pm |
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The only reason Catholics do not participate in Communion at Protestant Churches is their own choice. If they know Christ as their Saviour, they are welcome to share in the Lord's Supper.
abby
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kimdyuma
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Posted: Wed Jan 30th, 2008 11:37 pm |
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abbycat wrote: The only reason Catholics do not participate in Communion at Protestant Churches is their own choice. If they know Christ as their Saviour, they are welcome to share in the Lord's Supper.
abby
My Southern Baptist in laws would never take Communion at my Episcopal church before I became Catholic- They didn't agree with what the Episcopal church represented. There are also some Lutheran churches that only allow members from their particular branch of the Lutheran Church.
As far as not being allowed to take Communion in a Catholic Church unless your are a Catholic in GOOD standing ( it isn't carte blanche for Catholics either) that has been so from the depths of history. As much as it stings, part of the attraction for many in the Catholic Church is that the beliefs don't change with society. My Epsicopal church welcomed the unchurched and non believers to partake of communion- a policy that I found hugely troubling. Try not to take it personally- when you attend Mass you will see many people that don't go up for communion so you certainly not be the only person sitting in a pew.
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abbycat
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Posted: Thu Jan 31st, 2008 12:26 am |
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I do thank you all for the time you have taken in the CHN Forum to respond to me. However, the judgmentalism and elitism that bleeds through in many posts does not represent the real Body of Christ to me.
God bless you all in your journey of faith.
abby
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Credo Catholic
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Posted: Thu Jan 31st, 2008 12:42 am |
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abbycat wrote: The only reason Catholics do not participate in Communion at Protestant Churches is their own choice. If they know Christ as their Saviour, they are welcome to share in the Lord's Supper.
abby
Unfortunately, it's not a matter or choice, or of making people feel welcome. That's not what it's about. The word communion means "in union." Catholics are in union with the universal church. A non-catholic is in union with his surrounding fellowship. The Lord's Supper is not in any way the same as the catholic Holy Eucharist. By partaking of the Lord's Supper in a protestant church, I would be, in effect, agreeing with that church's idea of communion. I couldn't/wouldn't do it and it would have nothing to do with whether they invited me to do so. By receiving the Holy Eucharist at a catholic church, you would be publicly agreeing that you are eating the actual flesh and drinking the actual blood of our Lord, no symbolism involved! It involves submitting to the authority of the Pope, and apostolic succession which enables the priest to consecrate the host. I really do wish you would read some more about it, and go to a mass and get a better idea of the sacramental nature of it. Once you understand, you'll know there's no comparison. I don't want in any way to make you feel less a Christian, because I know there are many wonderful Christians who are protestant. I used to be one (not so wonderful). It's not about how much you have Jesus in your heart, exciting as that is. Somebody help me out here, I'm running out of persuasive words! Stay around Abby and let others give you a really good explanation.
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