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abbycat
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| Joined: | Thu Jan 17th, 2008 |
| Location: | Maryland USA |
| Posts: | 221 |
| First Name: | abby | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Non-Denomational Charismatic, Lutheran, Orthodox Catechumate |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 01:54 pm |
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Good morning .....
I spent several hours with one of my very closest friends yesterday ... we've been essentially on the same spiritual track for about 15 years or more. She is one of my trusted "heart friends." Well, I got into conversation with her about the books I've been reading and the questions I've had which sent me to still more resources. As we talked, I realized she began to get more uncomfortable. She knows I'm very restless in my present Lutheran church, and was SHOCKED when I left our evangelical/charismatic church some 5-6 years ago. I told her I planned to visit a new church this weekend and when she heard it was Catholic ... well, her entire countenance changed, she crossed her arms, and started firing questions at me. I know about a pitance amount about Catholicism, so obviously I could not really answer her questions in a truly intelligent way, which was probably good at that point. One thing she did ask me was "do you think that is the ONLY TRUE church?" Now, when evangelicals say this, they mean "do you think the rest of us are 'not saved'?" I was able to answer this to her satisfaction, apparently. Anyhow, when the conversation was over, she said "well, I'll still be friends with you." I must admit, I was happy to hear that, but was prepared to deal with the loss if she chose differently. It's interesting as I'm only visiting this church ... not necessarily inquiring or starting RCIA (which I think may be a distinct possibility at some point), and this is the response I have gotten from one of my dearest friends.
Well, as I've been praying, and admittedly a bit concerrned about all this, I just heard this morning on FOX News Channel that there is talk that President Bush is considering converting to Catholicism! He is meeting with the Pope today and the man (a Priest) who reports on FOX, said that the Vatican reporters are saying this and that they are VERY reliable.
Knowing the regard which my friend has for the President, I thought to myself "God you are full of miracles." I'm still waiting to hear if this is accurate, but it sounds very much like it is.
abby
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kersca
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| Joined: | Fri May 23rd, 2008 |
| Location: | USA |
| Posts: | 148 |
| First Name: | Adam | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lutheran-Catholic |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 02:11 pm |
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Abby,
Wow, she'll still be your friend? How gracious of her. Abby, you may begin to percieve that the Catholic Church evokes a whole new set of emotions from people. I was raised Lutheran and our whole church's existance was because the Catholic church had apparently gone entirely off track. That being said, I never met a Lutheran that could fairly and accurately explain the truth of Catholic doctrines. Truth be told, by the time they get to the objective investigation of grace, justification, etc... they are already primed to leave. I actually find that some of the most abusive statements of the Catholic Church come from former Catholics. Now, of course, they too are (shamefully) unaware of the truths of Catholic doctrines. They often will build this huge resentment against the Church because a nun pulled their hair in 2nd grade... Sad. Very rarely do you see people who are thoroughly acquainted with the teachings of the church leaving. Of course, there are some such as that former nun who has a website. However, her site is more kind than most. Actually, she leads people away from the church but at the same time dismisses many evangelical lies about the church as hogwash (such as pope Joan, calling priests father, etc....).
As far as Bush converting, I've seen it in the pipeline. Sadly, all of his evangelical backers will see him with the same type of contempt that your friend sees Catholics and I doubt they will "still be his friend". It is good for him though. His brother is a convert. We should all pray for him because if he converts he is truly leaving many behind that will never understand. Now, will this change his view on the death penalty?
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abbycat
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| Joined: | Thu Jan 17th, 2008 |
| Location: | Maryland USA |
| Posts: | 221 |
| First Name: | abby | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Non-Denomational Charismatic, Lutheran, Orthodox Catechumate |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 02:18 pm |
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Hi ... thank you so much for replying. She is still in my former, former (?) church - the non-denomational/Charismatic one ... and well ..... such terms as "whore of Babylon" while not overtly stated are part of the non-denom. mindset. Still be my friend .... it is interesting she phrased it that way, isn't it? I didn't know Pres. Bush was a convert ... that gives still more credence to this report I heard.
Well, no matter which way she goes, and no matter how the Lord continues to lead me, I know that I have to do what He wants me to do, no matter what. I know that is going to be difficult in some arenas - i.e. my 3 adult kids who were all raised non-denomational - but, if this is God's Plan, He will work all of this out. Guess I just can't help but worry a bit.
Thanks so much for your reply again ... guess I'm just in need of some support right now.
abby
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JillD
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Visalia, California USA |
| Posts: | 1001 |
| First Name: | Jill | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | heathen, EvFree, Messianic, LC-MS, Catholic 2007 |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 02:49 pm |
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God is leading you, Abby; let Him lead. Don't be afraid or intimidated by the world around you, whether friends (who will hopefully remain friends) or things you read or even the bad behavior of those in the Church to which He is leading you!
(In fact, a quote from GK Chesterton about this is:There is many a convert who has reached a stage at which no word from any Protestant or pagan could any longer hold him back. Only the word of a Catholic can keep him from Catholicism.)
This forum is and has been a necessary part of my conversion. Places like this not only answer our questions - answered by some very smart folks - but allow us to share our frustrations and our discoveries and to pray for each other.
I don't remember where the verse is, somewhere in Psalms, but it speaks to the fact that we pick up our feet and God places them down where He wills. Just keep pickin' 'em up and trusting God to keep you walking in His will.
Many blessings!
Jill
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"I praise you, for I am wondrously made. Wonderful are our works! My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret." Ps 139
"Guard me, O Lord, from the hands of the wicked; preserve me from violent men." Ps 140
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Free
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| Joined: | Wed Nov 28th, 2007 |
| Location: | Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 429 |
| First Name: | Jane | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Presbyterian, Gnostic, non-denominational, Catholic |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 03:05 pm |
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Praying for you, Abbycat. You are entering the hardest time, the most stressful time, when family and friends accuse, persecute, and turn their backs on us. Praise God you are on this forum and have plenty of us converts to encourage you and to assure you that once you have entered through the narrow gate, a pasture of plenty awaits you on the other side. If we go through the pain and the stress we come to a place of joy and calmness. We must, however, go through.
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abbycat
Member
| Joined: | Thu Jan 17th, 2008 |
| Location: | Maryland USA |
| Posts: | 221 |
| First Name: | abby | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Non-Denomational Charismatic, Lutheran, Orthodox Catechumate |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 03:44 pm |
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I just got an e-mail from my friend (who also works at my former church, just as I did), and she told me she is going to "discuss" this with one of the Pastors. This is a "mega-church" with several pastors, and I already know what any of them will tell her. It's only 10:30 AM and I'm already exhausted. Please pray for me.
abby
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JillD
Member
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Visalia, California USA |
| Posts: | 1001 |
| First Name: | Jill | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | heathen, EvFree, Messianic, LC-MS, Catholic 2007 |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 03:53 pm |
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Hang in, Abby. Read from your Bible, sing a hymn, protect your mind and spirit from oppression. Fill them with God, His words, His promises. Read from the Psalms.
You are on a God-led path. Don't let anything shake you.
And you are in our prayers.
Jill
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"I praise you, for I am wondrously made. Wonderful are our works! My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret." Ps 139
"Guard me, O Lord, from the hands of the wicked; preserve me from violent men." Ps 140
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Free
Member
| Joined: | Wed Nov 28th, 2007 |
| Location: | Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 429 |
| First Name: | Jane | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Presbyterian, Gnostic, non-denominational, Catholic |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 04:03 pm |
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Okay, if your friend wants to "discuss" with them, that's her perogative. I see a red flag, though. The next step is to call the "straying sheep" in to discuss things with her. Avoid this! It would take the apologetic knowledge of Dave Armstrong, and the stamina of an Olympic athlete to discuss things with the leaders of the church. I saw this happen more than once at the charismatic non-denom. I attended. It can be brutal. I sidestepped it, and I'm glad I did. Friendships can't last after an encounter like that.
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sewnsew
Member
| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Arizona USA |
| Posts: | 958 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | cradle Anglican, Episcopal /Catholic-04/07/07 |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 05:05 pm |
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Abby Cat: we have all been where you are today- the next few months will be hard but it all simmers down for a period while you are in RCIA, then right before Easter Vigil it will heat up again- possibly more but after the vigil it simmers down again to eventually the odd snippy comment. Expect that anytime there is "Catholic" news in the media it will flare again but never as much as what you face now and in the short future. My mom sent me 50 one line emails within the space of the first few hours after I told her! Not nice ones either! Ironically though one of my brothers is married to a Catholic and their child is baptised (quietly) in the Catholic church and my sister has moved in with a fellow and had a baby- his family is strongly catholic and they are talking about having her 7 year old from a previous marriage and this new baby baptized Catholic. ( She may well end up going the annulment route- I pray so anyhow) so out of 11 grandchild counting mine there are 5 Catholic kids possilby in the family. My meaner side gets a real laugh out of this
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Didi
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| Joined: | Mon Mar 3rd, 2008 |
| Location: | Oregon USA |
| Posts: | 252 |
| First Name: | Didi | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Catholic; almost left; Now an On-Fire Catholic! |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 07:31 pm |
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Hi Abby --
When I was going through a period of discernment regarding staying in the Catholic Church or leaving, I began learning more about the communion of saints and reading some of the lives of the saints.
One day in my daily Bible reading, I was reading the passage from Mark about Pilate desperately trying to find a way out of crucifying Jesus. As the crowd continues to press in, Pilate, "...wishing to satisfy the crowd, released for them Barabbas; and having scourged Jesus, he delivered him to be crucified." (Mark 15:15)
What really struck me here is that Pilate didn't want to harm Jesus, but he did want to satisfy the crowd.
Wow! How often do we do that? How often do we not want to cause problems so we keep our mouth shut about defending the faith, or go along with the crowd when we know it's wrong?
Then I thought: "What crowd is it that I want to please?"
I want to please Our Heavenly Father, and His Son Jesus Christ, together with the Holy Spirit. I want to please Our Mother Mary, given to us by Jesus, and her most chaste spouse, Joseph. I want to please the saints, especially those I know have interceded for me throughout my life. I want to please my guardian angel, who is protecting me at all times. I want to please all my loved ones in heaven. This is the crowd we should all strive to please!
Abby, I can't tell you how many times this thought has helped me when I am laughed at for being Catholic, or looked down upon, or ridiculed. The crowd in heaven is rejoicing for you that you are seeking God with a sincere heart, and they are praying for you every step of the way! And we are praying for you, too!
Many will ask you why you are choosing the Catholic Church, and they will try to stump you with questions. Just answer sincerely -- "I am feeling called by God to the Catholic Church, and I don't know the answer to your question yet, but I will find out. Please pray that I will follow where God is leading me."
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DaQuodJubes
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| Joined: | Thu Jan 31st, 2008 |
| Location: | Niles, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 18 |
| First Name: | Dan | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Former Lutheran |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 08:08 pm |
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Dear Abby,
You are in a difficult place right now, but you are not alone, and you are in the prayers of the saints.
I found that while many friends and family reacted poorly initially, they became more understanding with a little time (sometimes a lot of time) and conversation. Don't let first reactions discourage you.
Dan
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http://www.beatvsvir.blogspot.com
http://www.endingabortion.blogspot.com
God in His omnipotence could not give more,
in His wisdom He knew not how to give more,
in His riches He had not more to give,
than the Eucharist. - St. Augustine
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Intercessor
Member
| Joined: | Tue Sep 25th, 2007 |
| Location: | Southcentral, Kentucky USA |
| Posts: | 1546 |
| First Name: | Becky | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Southern Baptist, Catholic |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 09:04 pm |
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Abby, when I lit a candle for CHNI forum inquirers this morning, I mentioned you by name. You will remain in my prayers on a daily basis.
I hope you won't allow yourself to be led into a private discussion with pastors or church leaders. Once you make a decision to enter the Church, you can distribute a letter to friends and relatives, offering whatever explanation you wish to give, without interruption or unpleasant exchanges.
If you continue attending that church, you may want to slip out a small side door for a while. 
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Consider it all joy, my brothers, when you encounter various trials. . .the testing of your faith produces perseverance. Blessed is the man who perseveres in temptation, for when he has been proved he will receive the crown of life. . . NAB James 1:2-4,12
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abbycat
Member
| Joined: | Thu Jan 17th, 2008 |
| Location: | Maryland USA |
| Posts: | 221 |
| First Name: | abby | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Non-Denomational Charismatic, Lutheran, Orthodox Catechumate |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 09:18 pm |
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Hi .... I don't go to that church anymore. I've been in a Lutheran church for 5-6 years.
A good friend of mind suggested I get a DVD entitled "Common Ground" which is a conversation between an Evangelical Pastor and a Catholic Priest. He said it was what he used initially when talking with his family about his converting, he showed it to them. I've just ordered it. Thank God for good friends like that and this forum. I have a feeling even though I sense God is leading me on this journey, and I am sure I will run into more questions and skepticism from friends and possibly my kids ... if this is where God is guiding me, I will not be deterred. I truly appreciate your prayers. God bless you all ....
abby
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sewnsew
Member
| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Arizona USA |
| Posts: | 958 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | cradle Anglican, Episcopal /Catholic-04/07/07 |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 09:28 pm |
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| Abby: if you are like many of us it wil be like a little kid chasing the surf at the beach- you run into the froth and back out getting your toes wet- then the next thing you know you are boogie boarding in the big waves.
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kersca
Member
| Joined: | Fri May 23rd, 2008 |
| Location: | USA |
| Posts: | 148 |
| First Name: | Adam | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lutheran-Catholic |
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 10:22 pm |
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Abby,
Meeting with the pastor, eh? Well, while it seems hurtful on behalf of your friend you should realize her intentions are not "bad". From what she knows of the Catholic Church you are joining an idolatrous cult. She might not have the knowledge to make arguements against the things you have laid out for her so she is going to the pastor who is more knowledgable. Actually, her actions should be rather endearing to you. She cares that much to seek more help to "protect" you. Everyone was right though, a one on one meeting might be way too difficult. On this site I've seen people discourage taking too much time in diffferent bible studies and the like because you really have to know your stuff to even see if the stuff they are saying is in line with sound doctrine. Now, Abby, I never take anyone's word for it. I buy every new book on sola scriptura I can, protestant or Catholic. I am reading Luther's commentary on Romans and a Catholic book that takes the opposite point of view on justification right now. I am convinced that the Catholic arguements can stand criticism and scrutiny. Funny thing is, it was this open minded approach that originally led me to the Catholic Church. I said, "If the protestant idea of sola-scriptura is defensible, then it should be able to hold fast amidst an opposing view".
Good luck and God bless.
Adam
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EMarshallBuckles
Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 19th, 2007 |
| Location: | Rockville (Near Richmond), Virginia USA |
| Posts: | 683 |
| First Name: | Marshall | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Christian Church,Episcopal Church,Baptist denomination,learning about RCC |
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Posted: Sat Jun 14th, 2008 04:58 am |
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As some of you may recall, although I am still a member of a protestant denomination, I hold the Catholic Church in the highest respect and esteem. I have a twin brother who joined the Catholic Church back in the early 1980s. When he did so, I had no negative feelings about it whatsoever. Had he said that he was becoming a member of some organization such as the Jehovah's Witnesses or some other (in my opinion) cult or pagan religion, then, yes, I would have had some very strong negative feelings about that and would have attempted to convince him to not do that. However, Catholic was fine. And the Catholic Church has been a great blessing to him, a wonderful church home to him for which I dearly love the Catholic Church. Personally, I "leave open the door" that the Catholic Church may well be the "one true church" ("well, DUH, Marshall, ya THINK"   ) , however, I see much evidence that God does work through other - what I think of as - "mainstream" denominations which it seems to me that God may "use as a safety net" for many people who do not become Catholic Church members for whatever reasons. Sort of like the Good Shepherd seeking lost sheep, so to speak. Anyway, when I hear that someone has gone from one (what I think of as) "mainstream denomination" to another, I am not really worried about them realizing that God will, in God's own good time, shepherd them to heaven even though God might prefer that they become Roman Catholics. If I hear of someone in a non-Catholic "mainstream" denomination say that their non-Catholic denomination is the "ONLY" legitimate denomination, then I sadly shake may head and think to myself "sorry, my friend, I believe that you are mistaken."
As for the possibility of President Bush becoming a Catholic, if he does, that is fine with me. I tend to doubt that he will do that, if he does, while in office. Probably will wait until after he has been out of office for a while. If he does, I wonder if he might go to Rome and let the Pope initiate him into the Catholic Church. It will be interesting to see what happens. Here in Virginia, we do have a Roman Catholic Governor! Now if we could just convince him to join the Republican Party, ha, ha!
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