 |
| Author | Post |
|---|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5348 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 06:31 pm |
|
Fr. Frank Pavone, head of Priests for Life, sent the following commentary in his weekly message:
"And What I Have Failed To Do..." What's this I hear from some people that they might "sit out" the Presidential election because they aren't comfortable with the likely choice of candidates?
Since when are elections supposed to make us "comfortable?" Since when do we exercise that right to vote, for which people fought and died, only when it's easy and clear-cut, and our choices are just the way we want them to be?
At Mass we pray, "I confess to Almighty God...that I have sinned...in my thoughts and in my words, in what I have done, and in what I have failed to do..."
What we fail to do can make us just as guilty as what we do. A sin is a wrong choice, and to decide not to do something is just as much of a choice as to decide to do something.
A sin of omission is still a sin - and we are still responsible for the results.
What, then, makes us think that we are more responsible for the results of voting than for the results of not voting?
A vote is not a philosophical statement. It is a transfer of power. It is a pragmatic act to preserve, as much as possible under the circumstances, the common good, and to limit the evils that threaten it.
And in the pragmatic matter of elections, what matters is not how closely a candidate measures up to my preferences and convictions. Instead, it's a question of who can and will actually get elected. It does little good if the person I felt most comfortable supporting doesn't get to actually govern and implement those positions I like so much.
The vote can be used just as much to keep someone out of office as to put someone in.
If we fail to use that tool, however, and as a result the person who gets elected is far worse and does far more damage than the other person we did not like, then we still share responsibility for the damage that will be done.
Elections have seasons. In the earliest phases, the field is wide open. We can recruit candidates, or decide to run ourselves. We build up the name recognition and base of support for the person or people who would make the best candidate. This takes years of work.
Then the season of primaries arrives, during which voters choose between the candidates who have been recruited and who have been building up their strength.
Then the general election season arrives, and we may find that we don't like any of the names on the ballot. At that point, we have to shift our thinking and focus on "better" rather than "best." The reality usually is that one of several unsatisfactory candidates will in fact be elected. So we use our vote to create the better outcome and to limit the damage. ThatÂ’s the shift that some fail to make.
And we are still responsible for what we fail to do.
This column can be found online at
http://www.priestsforlife.org/columns/columns2008/08-02-25-what-i-have-failed-to-do.htm
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
JasPax
Member
| Joined: | Wed Nov 22nd, 2006 |
| Location: | North Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 247 |
| First Name: | James | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Episcopal to Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 06:53 pm |
|
Good for Fr. Frank Pavone. Very well said !
Now, how will Catholics vote? It seems that candidates don't consider them a voting "block" as they do Evangelicals. Why is that?
I was watching a TV news segment on religion in America in the last day or so, (I can't remember which network), and one of the persons being questioned was a student from the U. of Dayton. She announced, "I'm Catholic and I'm "pro-choice."
That is just beyond my understanding.
____________________
James
"Abide in me, and I in you..." John 15:4
"He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him." John 6:56
RSV-2CE
|
|
|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5348 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 07:00 pm |
|
JasPax wrote: Now, how will Catholics vote? It seems that candidates don't consider them a voting "block" as they do Evangelicals. Why is that?
Historically Catholics vote Democrat. Catholics are primarily the children of immigrants, and immigrant populations tend to be Democrats. Whether it be Obama or Clinton, the Democrat is likely to get the majority of the Catholic vote.
I'm not saying I agree with that, just that it is a fact.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
JillD
Member
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Visalia, California USA |
| Posts: | 768 |
| First Name: | Jill | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | heathen, EvFree, Messianic, LC-MS, Catholic 2007 |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 07:03 pm |
|
I'm not going to sit it out, but I am going to "waste" my vote by writing in a better candidate for Prez. There is no one whose name will get my "X."
____________________
"I praise you, for I am wondrously made. Wonderful are our works! My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret." Ps 139
"Guard me, O Lord, from the hands of the wicked; preserve me from violent men." Ps 140
|
|
|
Credo Catholic
Member
| Joined: | Sat May 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Greenville, South Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 1382 |
| First Name: | Marsha | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 05:21 am |
|
At this point I intend to vote for McCain. That is subject to change. Clinton and Obama are way, way too liberal. Huckabee can't pull in enough delegates. McCain is anti-abortion but in favor of embryonic stem-cell research. He is strong on foreign issues, but not as strong as I'd like against illegal immigration. He's not perfect, but he comes the closest to what I want.
I really think Clinton is struggling and is not going to be the shoo-in that we thought a couple of months ago she would be. Obama is the most liberal senator in Washington, per Fox news tonight. I just think there are a lot of middle America, middle class conservatives who won't go for him. That's my prayer anyway!!
|
|
|
DrDave
Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 6th, 2006 |
| Location: | Mildura, Australia |
| Posts: | 226 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Cradle - Lapsed - Renewed Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 09:55 pm |
|
JillD wrote: I'm not going to sit it out, but I am going to "waste" my vote by writing in a better candidate for Prez. There is no one whose name will get my "X."
Jill, you certainly have a right to do so, but I still question this attitude. Florida showed us a few years ago how important every single vote is.
Imagine a situation where Candidate A (rabidly pro-abortion) is up against Candidate B (Claims to be pro-abortion because he thinks there's votes in them thar hills)the vote is tied, 129,234,643 to 129,234,643. The last vote to be drawn out is Jill's, who voted for CajunRick, then through some obscure loophole in a Federal legal Challenge Candidate A wins in some sort of countback process. The first thing Candidate A does in office is write in to law that abortions are mandatory for anyone who cannot demonstrate that they have the means to raise a child.
Some people might suggest that it was all your fault, but I wouldn't (I like you too much ) besides there are millions who actively voted for that person. But the bottom line is you have the opportunity to make that difference.
Regards Doc
|
|
|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5348 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 09:58 pm |
|
DrDave wrote: the vote is tied, 129,234,643 to 129,234,643. The last vote to be drawn out is Jill's, who voted for CajunRick,
If Federal law made any sense, A and B would be disqualified on the basis of the tie. Wouldn't that be a fine kettle of fish! (Or crawfish if you prefer!)
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
JillD
Member
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Visalia, California USA |
| Posts: | 768 |
| First Name: | Jill | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | heathen, EvFree, Messianic, LC-MS, Catholic 2007 |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 10:22 pm |
|
Doctah Dave said:
Jill, you certainly have a right to do so, but I still question this attitude.
The deal is that I dislike Sen. McCain a lot. I don't believe him; I think he's frightening in his behavior; I believe he is less an advocate, in general, of civil rights than either Obama or Hillary and I simply CANNOT vote for him. It is my opinion that all of the "at least he's (fill in the blank)" for McCain are invalid. I admit, I have been greatly influenced by this article:
http://www.donfeder.com/articles/0802Mc-Psycho.htm
But it affirmed what I was already sensing about him.
I think we are very bad shape no matter who wins - unless my write-in Romney campaign works out... 
Jill
____________________
"I praise you, for I am wondrously made. Wonderful are our works! My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret." Ps 139
"Guard me, O Lord, from the hands of the wicked; preserve me from violent men." Ps 140
|
|
|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5348 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Thu Feb 28th, 2008 12:58 am |
|
JillD wrote: I think we are very bad shape no matter who wins - unless my write-in Romney campaign works out...
Write-ins are not allowed in Louisiana. I will not rule out voting for a third-party candidate but the overwhelming liklihood is that I will vote for the least objectionable of the major candidates, and at this point that appears to be McCain. I know for certain there was and is not a single Democrat in this race that I could vote for under any circumstances.
At one time I stated that I would vote for anyone before Hillary Clinton, but I have to admit if the election were held today and the only choices available to me were the remaining Democrat candidates, I would have to vote for her. The thought of having her as president (and her husband back in the White House) truly frightens me, but the thought of having Barack Obama in there frightens me even more.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
Annie
Banned
| Joined: | Wed Feb 14th, 2007 |
| Location: | Columbus, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 731 |
| First Name: | Annie | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nothing, Quaker, Mennonite, Presbyterian, Methodist, Anglican, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 29th, 2008 03:52 pm |
|
JillD wrote: Doctah Dave said:
Jill, you certainly have a right to do so, but I still question this attitude.
The deal is that I dislike Sen. McCain a lot. I don't believe him; I think he's frightening in his behavior; I believe he is less an advocate, in general, of civil rights than either Obama or Hillary and I simply CANNOT vote for him. It is my opinion that all of the "at least he's (fill in the blank)" for McCain are invalid. I admit, I have been greatly influenced by this article:
http://www.donfeder.com/articles/0802Mc-Psycho.htm
But it affirmed what I was already sensing about him.
I think we are very bad shape no matter who wins - unless my write-in Romney campaign works out...
Jill
I stopped reading when I got to this:
"Not for nothing did Benjamin Disraeli call conservatives the stupid party."
Remember Obama saying recently he was sorry he didn't stand up more vehemently for killing Terri Schiavo? *gag*
The ultimate human rights issue is what you do with unborn children and disabled people. The Democratic party is officially the party of abortion and euthanasia. It is already accepted to abort a baby that will be born handicapped. How long before we extend that to people who are already alive? Like yours truly who is already having trouble putting on her socks.
rolling around on the floor, yelling get back here to my right foot,
Last edited on Fri Feb 29th, 2008 03:55 pm by Annie
____________________
Annie
Ora et labora
|
|
|
Credo Catholic
Member
| Joined: | Sat May 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Greenville, South Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 1382 |
| First Name: | Marsha | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 29th, 2008 04:17 pm |
|
Annie wrote:
The ultimate human rights issue is what you do with unborn children and disabled people. The Democratic party is officially the party of abortion and euthanasia. It is already accepted to abort a baby that will be born handicapped. How long before we extend that to people who are already alive? Like yours truly who is already having trouble putting on her socks.
rolling around on the floor, yelling get back here to my right foot,
Annie, I thought about you this morning as I struggled to bend over to get dressed! Moans and groans ... the dog thinks I'm making silly sounds to play with her. Arthritis is playing with my quality of life big time.
Unless McCain trips over a rug some Democrat rolled up looking for dirt, he's going to be the GOP nominee, and I don't see a viable choice. Jill's article above is too over the top to be convincing to me. And even if I believed most of it, which I don't, I'd still be left with a DEM vote and that's unacceptable. And not voting for a viable candidate is close to voting for the other side! Sorry Jill, I love ya but can't agree on this one. 
|
|
|
Annie
Banned
| Joined: | Wed Feb 14th, 2007 |
| Location: | Columbus, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 731 |
| First Name: | Annie | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nothing, Quaker, Mennonite, Presbyterian, Methodist, Anglican, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 29th, 2008 04:52 pm |
|
Again we have the problem of people making decisions based on secondary or tertiary information. Consider the source.
It will not be the president who will make a decision regarding the funding of programs which Catholics feel are repugnant, that is done first through Congress. We have to vote for the important important issue first, which is abortion. After we get people up to speed about abortion they will see the folly of stem cell research but not before they start seeing fully formed babies as human. This is the logical fact. People are thinking of even third trimester babies as "clumps of cells" and a single stem cell is nothing to them. They will have to first come to realize that babies are babies and then realize that a single human cell is as human as you or I.
A Democrat vote is automatically a vote for destroying clumps of cells of various ages and sizes, some up to 90 years old.
____________________
Annie
Ora et labora
|
|
|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5348 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 29th, 2008 07:43 pm |
|
Annie wrote: It is already accepted to abort a baby that will be born handicapped. How long before we extend that to people who are already alive?
In the Netherlands it is acceptable to abort a "defective" child until his 12th birthday. Euthanasia is also a "right" permitted in most European countries, as well as in Oregon.
BTW, my own congressman, Charles Melancon, is a Democrat with a 100% pro-life voting record. There are a few of them out there. I didn't vote for him, but not for that reason. I didn't want to help turn the House over to Nancy Pelosi. Still, it is possible to vote for a Democrat for congress and still vote pro-life, at least in Louisiana.
Last edited on Fri Feb 29th, 2008 07:46 pm by CajunRick
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
JasPax
Member
| Joined: | Wed Nov 22nd, 2006 |
| Location: | North Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 247 |
| First Name: | James | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Episcopal to Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 29th, 2008 08:31 pm |
|
JillD wrote: I'm not going to sit it out, but I am going to "waste" my vote by writing in a better candidate for Prez. There is no one whose name will get my "X."
Jill. You cetainly have the right to do that but, with respect, this is why I think that is a bad idea:
If Hillary Clinton or Barak Obama win the general election, we can expect the appointment of Federal Judges, especially Supreme Court appointments, to be in the order of Ruth Bader Ginsburg. Or perhaps worse !
Sure, John McCain was not my first choice, but there is a good chance that he will appoint judges who will not legislate from the bench. If we get more Ginsburgs there is no chance that Roe v. Wade will be overturned or restricted for many years to come. Certainly not in the lifetime of anyone over forty. The liberals will see that the court is packed with pro-abortionist. No matter what they say, abortion has become the central issue of their party. That is why they went after Judge Thomas with such hatred.
BTW, as a former union activist, I used to vote Democratic. That was before !
Consider, how many babies will die for sure if there is no chance that changes can be made to Roe v. Wade?
Standing up for principles is a noble position. But the issues are bigger than any one of us. IMO.
God's Blessings,
____________________
James
"Abide in me, and I in you..." John 15:4
"He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him." John 6:56
RSV-2CE
|
|
|
BeProf
Member
| Joined: | Thu Jan 3rd, 2008 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 75 |
| First Name: | Ed | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Independent Fundamental Baptist - Atheism - Christian & Missionary Alliance |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 29th, 2008 09:22 pm |
|
I'm going to be honest... I'm having trouble deciding whether or not I'm going to vote in this election or not.
I know all the logical arguments for the "lesser of two evils" but it seems like *all* I've been voting for my entire life is the lesser of two evils. Frankly, I'm sick of it. I've had a belly full of it and I just can't take anymore.
Especially in this election. My choice seems to be between "kill lots of babies in the name of choice" and "kill lots of babies in the name of research." It feels like trying to pick between Hitler and Stalin. Seriously.
I don't know... I don't want to give into despair but I'm so angry I just want to abstain as a way of saying, "a pox on both your houses!"
|
|
|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5348 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 29th, 2008 09:34 pm |
|
BeProf wrote: My choice seems to be between "kill lots of babies in the name of choice" and "kill lots of babies in the name of research."
I don't think that's quite the proper assessment. It's more like, "Kill a lot of babies in the name of choice and a lot more babies in the name of research" or "kill a lot of babies in the name of research but relatively few in the name of choice".
One big difference is that either Democrat candidate will make federally-funded abortion on demand available at military hospitals and through Medicaid. They will also likely mandate that private health care cover abortion on demand. The Republican candidates will not. A Democrat will also make absolutely certain that any federal judges appointed to the Supreme Court will uphold Roe V. Wade. At worst, a Republican president will appoint a strict constructionist to the Supreme Court, which increases the liklihood of restricting the number of abortions.
So electing a Democrat will result in the death of a vastly greater number of babies than a Republican, regardless of how you slice the pie.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
tedjenczewski
Member
| Joined: | Thu May 10th, 2007 |
| Location: | Richmond, Virginia USA |
| Posts: | 263 |
| First Name: | Ted | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, Presbyterian, revert Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Sat Mar 1st, 2008 01:04 am |
|
| Religion AND politics on ths forum. A great combination for unemotional discussion.
____________________
"...the church of the living God, the pillar and bulwark of the truth." 1Tim 3, 15
|
|
|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5348 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Sat Mar 1st, 2008 02:08 am |
|
tedjenczewski wrote: Religion AND politics on ths forum. A great combination for unemotional discussion.
Didn't Jesus tell us he didn't come to bring peace?
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
Current time is 05:00 am | |
|
|
|
|
|
