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Dave Armstrong
Network Apologist
| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1869 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Evangelical (1977): Diverse Protestant Influences / Catholic in 1990 |
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 08:30 pm |
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My greatest physical feat ever was hiking 17 miles at about 9000 feet elevation in Rocky Mountain National Park, with a backpack (1979); also hiking from the bottom of the Grand Canyon to the top (about a mile raise in elevation, on a hot July day in 1978).
Of course, I was a young whippersnapper then (20-21), but just last summer my three sons and I did a grueling hike to the top of Mt. Washington in New Hampshire (el. 6288, and some 3500 foot rise in elevation). The last half-mile or so is at about a 45 degree angle, and literally all rock climbing (big jagged boulders). All the pain was in the knees (and mine are traditionally weak, from years of sports -- as you were arguing earlier!).
I survived that, but when I was taking my ease in my backpacker's hammock in camp the next day (after my 6-1 son had just been in it for a good long time), getting all set for one or two hours of relaxation, the rope broke and I fell about three feet onto a pointed rock, right at the top of my hip bone, and experienced the second greatest pain I've ever had in my life: the first being a torn rotator cuff in my shoulder, from playing basketball, three years ago.
Excruciating pain; felt like my nerves were on fire, or like being stabbed with a hot poker. But when my wife went to get some ice in town, in my extreme stubbornness I determined to walk around and gather lots of wood for the fire, by rolling big logs with my feet. When they got back, it was a huge pile. 
Nothing ever stops me!
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I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 2000+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
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Candlemass
Member
| Joined: | Tue May 1st, 2007 |
| Location: | Hudson, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 481 |
| First Name: | Mark | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, AOG, Baptist, non - denominational, Anglican, RCC for life! |
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 08:34 pm |
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Dave Armstrong wrote:
Nothing ever stops me!
Oh really?
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"For I the blind who once could see, the bell tolls for me!"
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Dave Armstrong
Network Apologist
| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1869 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Evangelical (1977): Diverse Protestant Influences / Catholic in 1990 |
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 08:43 pm |
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LOLOL! That scary cap with the skull would scare the wits out of anyone! 
____________________
I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 2000+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
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Parodyonlife
Member
| Joined: | Mon Jan 14th, 2008 |
| Location: | Corning, New York USA |
| Posts: | 113 |
| First Name: | John | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | NEW CATHOLIC!!! W( ) ( )T!!! |
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 09:02 pm |
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ooga booga. saws.... They scare us all...
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Candlemass
Member
| Joined: | Tue May 1st, 2007 |
| Location: | Hudson, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 481 |
| First Name: | Mark | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, AOG, Baptist, non - denominational, Anglican, RCC for life! |
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 09:09 pm |
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Yea, but as you can see from my avatar, I clean up nice! 
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"For I the blind who once could see, the bell tolls for me!"
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Parodyonlife
Member
| Joined: | Mon Jan 14th, 2008 |
| Location: | Corning, New York USA |
| Posts: | 113 |
| First Name: | John | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | NEW CATHOLIC!!! W( ) ( )T!!! |
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 09:14 pm |
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| LOL.
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MysticalRose128
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 09:42 pm |
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| How 'bout that sunburn, Rick?? Didn't that stop you any??? OUCH!!
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Mater Dolorosa, cause of our joy -- pray for us!
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MysticalRose128
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 09:49 pm |
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Hiya, John ... sins were recently explained to me like this: venial sins to the soul are like grains of sand. Mortal sins to the soul are like bricks of lead.
Many venial sins, like many grains of sand, add up, and can weigh as much as a few bricks of lead, if not more.
Also ... as a kid I was taught that venial sins can lead to mortal sin. And I think John Paul the Great said that generally we are losing our sense of sin. (Mods -- correct me if I've quoted incorrectly!)
So I see my smoking AFTER knowing full well the damage it does to my body is sinful, and I will leave it to God to determine how sinful. However, the sacrament of Confession has done wonders for my soul -- and my outlook on life!!
Hugs,
Judi (who is still smoke-free going on 3 weeks!!!!)
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Mater Dolorosa, cause of our joy -- pray for us!
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Parodyonlife
Member
| Joined: | Mon Jan 14th, 2008 |
| Location: | Corning, New York USA |
| Posts: | 113 |
| First Name: | John | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | NEW CATHOLIC!!! W( ) ( )T!!! |
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Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 10:07 pm |
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I agree totally with you!  But a couple packs a year isn't mortal, i don't think but stepping out of church to, smoke a pack cause you have the shakes. Is obviously Mortal. It's different for everyone if smoking all teh time isn't seperating you from God by all means smoke. But if it is causing problems dont.
Last edited on Tue Feb 26th, 2008 10:10 pm by Parodyonlife
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Kim M.
Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
| Location: | Georgia USA |
| Posts: | 415 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Assembly of God, Church of God, Assembly again, PCA, ... |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 12:48 am |
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Dave Armstrong wrote: My greatest physical feat ever was hiking 17 miles at about 9000 feet elevation in Rocky Mountain National Park, with a backpack (1979); also hiking from the bottom of the Grand Canyon to the top (about a mile raise in elevation, on a hot July day in 1978).
Of course, I was a young whippersnapper then (20-21), but just last summer my three sons and I did a grueling hike to the top of Mt. Washington in New Hampshire (el. 6288, and some 3500 foot rise in elevation). The last half-mile or so is at about a 45 degree angle, and literally all rock climbing (big jagged boulders). All the pain was in the knees (and mine are traditionally weak, from years of sports -- as you were arguing earlier!).
I survived that, but when I was taking my ease in my backpacker's hammock in camp the next day (after my 6-1 son had just been in it for a good long time), getting all set for one or two hours of relaxation, the rope broke and I fell about three feet onto a pointed rock, right at the top of my hip bone, and experienced the second greatest pain I've ever had in my life: the first being a torn rotator cuff in my shoulder, from playing basketball, three years ago.
Excruciating pain; felt like my nerves were on fire, or like being stabbed with a hot poker. But when my wife went to get some ice in town, in my extreme stubbornness I determined to walk around and gather lots of wood for the fire, by rolling big logs with my feet. When they got back, it was a huge pile.
Nothing ever stops me!
OUCH!!! Oh man! I felt pain just reading that! (the fall, I mean) I tore my rotator cuff and will be getting surgery probably in April. *sigh* Did you have surgery, or were you a good boy and didn't use that arm for a long time and it healed naturally?
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"A joyful heart is the health of the body, but a depressed spirit dries up the bones." Proverbs 17:22
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Kim M.
Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
| Location: | Georgia USA |
| Posts: | 415 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Assembly of God, Church of God, Assembly again, PCA, ... |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 12:49 am |
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Candlemass wrote:Oh really?
lol Show off!!
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"A joyful heart is the health of the body, but a depressed spirit dries up the bones." Proverbs 17:22
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Kim M.
Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
| Location: | Georgia USA |
| Posts: | 415 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Assembly of God, Church of God, Assembly again, PCA, ... |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 12:50 am |
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Hey, I just did my 100th post! Do I talk too much, or what! 
Last edited on Wed Feb 27th, 2008 12:50 am by Kim M.
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"A joyful heart is the health of the body, but a depressed spirit dries up the bones." Proverbs 17:22
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Kim M.
Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
| Location: | Georgia USA |
| Posts: | 415 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Assembly of God, Church of God, Assembly again, PCA, ... |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 12:53 am |
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MysticalRose128 wrote: Judi (who is still smoke-free going on 3 weeks!!!!)
Congrats, Judi! I hope you can kick it permanently this time.
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"A joyful heart is the health of the body, but a depressed spirit dries up the bones." Proverbs 17:22
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Kim M.
Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
| Location: | Georgia USA |
| Posts: | 415 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Assembly of God, Church of God, Assembly again, PCA, ... |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 12:58 am |
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Candlemass wrote: I have a friend of mine who goes out on jobs w/me on occasion, he plays hoops a few times a week in a league, works out in the weight room, decent shape and doesn't smoke. We did a big mulch job, I remember him comming around the corner w/the wheel barrel and his face was beat red, looked like he was about to die!
Sounds like me! I get beet red when I work in the yard. I have a mild version of mitral valve prolapse, and I think it might have something to do with it. Could be he does, too. Ya nebber know!
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"A joyful heart is the health of the body, but a depressed spirit dries up the bones." Proverbs 17:22
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MysticalRose128
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 01:02 am |
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Thank you, dear Kim!!
I love a talker! My mother always said "be careful of the quiet ones" ...
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Mater Dolorosa, cause of our joy -- pray for us!
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5457 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 01:03 am |
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Kim M. wrote: Hey, I just did my 100th post! Do I talk too much, or what!
Yeah, a veritable fountain of fabulosity!
(What am I up to now? It's really not my fault. Kermie sits on my lap and types.)
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 5457 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 01:04 am |
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MysticalRose128 wrote: Judi (who is still smoke-free going on 3 weeks!!!!)
Congrats, Judi. I'm going on 21 years, so it is possible!
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Kim M.
Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
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| Posts: | 415 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Assembly of God, Church of God, Assembly again, PCA, ... |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 01:25 am |
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CajunRick wrote: (What am I up to now? It's really not my fault. Kermie sits on my lap and types.)
Oh, that explains it! *snort*
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"A joyful heart is the health of the body, but a depressed spirit dries up the bones." Proverbs 17:22
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5457 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 03:34 am |
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Kim M. wrote: CajunRick wrote: (What am I up to now? It's really not my fault. Kermie sits on my lap and types.)
Oh, that explains it! *snort*
Trust me. I have an excuse for everything. It all started before I was born, when the doctors told my mother she couldn't have any more children....
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Annie
Banned
| Joined: | Wed Feb 14th, 2007 |
| Location: | Columbus, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 731 |
| First Name: | Annie | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nothing, Quaker, Mennonite, Presbyterian, Methodist, Anglican, Catholic |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 12:13 pm |
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Dave Armstrong wrote: Hi Ali,
Could not the same be said for circumcision, then? The removing of the clitoris is the same basic part as removing the foreskin.
Didja write a paper on that?
Very funny.  I'll have to write a paper on you one of these days.
Circumcision doesn't particularly affect male pleasure, as far as I know (arguably -- without getting into excruciating detail -- it increases it), nor is it analogous to female circumcision, since, to eliminate you know what for a man would require castration or emasculation (look it up!).
Secondly, circumcision was expressly sanctioned by God, so it could hardly be deemed sinful. It was known to lessen the instance of infection, but today health is hardly a factor whether it is performed or not.
And I don't want a sub-thread devoted to this! LOLOL
Hate to have to do this but, this "female thing" is a serious problem. This surgery, usually performed with a broken bottle, is much more extensive than the name would imply and is a cause of the rapidity of the spread of HIV in Africa. Unfortunately this practice has spread here. I know some women who moved here so they could avoid this barbaric torture, for that is what it is, it causes permanent open wounds that never heal and constant pain. The purpose of it is to make a woman faithful to their husband by rendering her incapable of experiencing sexual pleasure. That is important in cultures that practice polygamy.
And this procedure is equivalent not to castration but to removal of the entire penis. (OW!)
Getting ready to barf now,
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Annie
Ora et labora
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Dave Armstrong
Network Apologist
| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1869 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Evangelical (1977): Diverse Protestant Influences / Catholic in 1990 |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 06:34 pm |
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Hi Kim,
I tore my rotator cuff and will be getting surgery probably in April. *sigh* Did you have surgery, or were you a good boy and didn't use that arm for a long time and it healed naturally?
Because of lack of funds (apologetics not being the world's most lucrative profession), I just let time heal it. It took a good year and a half. I couldn't raise my hand above my shoulder; couldn't come close to being able to touch the upper middle of my back with the injured arm. But it healed and now is about 97% as good as it was. Just a very slight pain when I fold my arms behind my head.
Time heals all wounds! (?).
Physical therapy is an option to surgery. The latter sometimes causes it to be even worse, so I heard.
____________________
I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 2000+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
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Dave Armstrong
Network Apologist
| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1869 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Evangelical (1977): Diverse Protestant Influences / Catholic in 1990 |
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Posted: Wed Feb 27th, 2008 08:20 pm |
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I found some related pages: (Catholics) "Is smoking cigarettes wrong?" Fr. Timothy Johnson gives a great answer.
Religious Involvement and Cigarette Smoking in Young Adults (study in the Archives of Internal Medicine)
Attack on Smoking Gets Papal Blessing [actually not the pope, but in a Catholic publication monitored by the Vatican]
____________________
I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 2000+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
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Parodyonlife
Member
| Joined: | Mon Jan 14th, 2008 |
| Location: | Corning, New York USA |
| Posts: | 113 |
| First Name: | John | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | NEW CATHOLIC!!! W( ) ( )T!!! |
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Posted: Thu Feb 28th, 2008 12:53 am |
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I talked to a Priest today and he said at most the addiction to smoking is a venial sin.
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germangreek
Member
| Joined: | Tue Feb 26th, 2008 |
| Location: | Lansing, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 23 |
| First Name: | Richard | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, (Charismatic and still) Catholic |
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Posted: Thu Feb 28th, 2008 02:55 am |
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Several years ago I was at a friend's house in the evening and he offered me a glass of port to accompany our conversation. And as I was enjoying the fellowship, and the port, the thought struck me, "A good cigar would be perfect right now!" Ah! that's why English gentlemen, in the Victorian age, would retire to the drawing room after dinner for port and cigars.
Had I been offered a cigar at the time, it would have been probably the dozenth cigar of my life, and it would have been, like the alcohol, an excellent accompaniment to the social situation. Not that I draw all my moral conclusions from tangential considerations arising from private conversations, but that strikes me as a pretty good basis for drawing some conclusions. Moderate tobacco use surely does not damage the body any more than moderate alcohol use does, and can enhance a social situation. I know people who smoke three or four cigarettes during a wedding reception, and then don't smoke again until the next wedding reception. None of the studies and scenarios you present contemplate minimal to moderate use, from which the body readily recovers. Ah, dangerous concession, that! If we do something from which the body needs to recover, perhaps we shouldn't do it? That's alright, I'll stick with my insight. Our bodies have to recover from alcohol use also.
My wife, on the other hand, is certain that if she had another cigarette she'd resume the one-to-two pack a day habit that she broke before I met her. For her, that would be wrong, and she laudably avoids the occasion of it.
Temperance (the virtue, not the political position) is the key. Proper use is licit, damaging use is sinful.
regards,
germangreek
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"The purpose of an open mind, like that of an open mouth, is to close it on something solid." GK Chesterton.
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Kim M.
Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
| Location: | Georgia USA |
| Posts: | 415 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Assembly of God, Church of God, Assembly again, PCA, ... |
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Posted: Thu Feb 28th, 2008 09:43 pm |
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Dave Armstrong wrote: Hi Kim,
I tore my rotator cuff and will be getting surgery probably in April. *sigh* Did you have surgery, or were you a good boy and didn't use that arm for a long time and it healed naturally?
Because of lack of funds (apologetics not being the world's most lucrative profession), I just let time heal it | | |
