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brian
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Chicago South Burbs, Illinois USA |
| Posts: | 803 |
| First Name: | brian | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | methodist, evangelical, anglican, catholic |
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Posted: Tue Sep 18th, 2007 04:08 pm |
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When I was an evangelical and a bit critical of us the Catholic Church I used to find it somehow offensive that they helpd fundraisers cetnered around gambling like a casino night etc.
Now I think that gambling can be an acceptable form of entertainment, yet there are so many reasons why it can turn into a vice that I think perosnally it best to be very cautious or stay away so as not to encourage others.
anyway, is there nything that has or does discourage churches from using gambling events as a fundraiser? Or does it matter if the winners keep the money, or maybe what they do is that it is play money and the church keeps all the winnings?
Because a church I am affiliated with is having a Texas Hold 'em tournament fundraiser (a game I love) and my father who also loves the game has offered to pay my buy in if I play in it with him.
Is there any reason I should not encourage or participate in this, or should I trust that the church is accounable for what they decide to do, and if they feel ok about having the event I should feel ok about participating for fun and charity?
I did get somewhat attached to this game a few years ago or so, and played online (illegally, although the legality was debated by some at the time)quite a bit as well. Now, I am positive that I am completely over that, and I do not at all wory that playing in this will get me back into it in a negative way. I really have no deisre for it and I am sure I can stay away and even enjoy a friendly game here and then with friends.
But since I know that it does have a negative side for some people should I simply not do it. Does the church discourage this type of event, or is it completely fiine and in good fun? I am leaning towards doing it I guess, unless I find that they are hosting it against some sort of advice from higher up in the Church or general wisdom.
Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2007 05:11 pm by brian
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Annie
Banned
| Joined: | Wed Feb 14th, 2007 |
| Location: | Columbus, Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 731 |
| First Name: | Annie | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nothing, Quaker, Mennonite, Presbyterian, Methodist, Anglican, Catholic |
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Posted: Tue Sep 18th, 2007 04:17 pm |
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| One would think the Church would classify this as a near occasion of sin but apparently not.
____________________
Annie
Ora et labora
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David W. Emery
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Brownsville, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 2074 |
| First Name: | David | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic |
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Posted: Tue Sep 18th, 2007 09:30 pm |
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Brian, some people cannot tolerate alcohol; for them to partake would be a near occasion of sin. Yet Jesus did not condemn wine, but in fact ordained it as matter for the Eucharist. With proper precaution, even alcoholics can receive the Eucharist, because the chalice is not required except for the priest.
In like manner, there are some people who cannot tolerate a friendly game. For them, it would be a near occasion of sin. If you want to join your father in a fund raising game and are not at risk for gambling addiction, feel free to do so.
David
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CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5348 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Tue Sep 18th, 2007 10:44 pm |
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I don't disagree with David, but I admit I find it distasteful for a church to use gambling as a fundraising mechanism. It is my personal choice not to participate, except perhaps to buy an occasional raffle ticket (which I consider a donation rather than gambling). Then again, I've never touched a slot machine, video poker machine, or visited a casino either.
My former bishop Warren Boudreaux announced in 1985 that he was establishing a ban on all fundraising activities. He banned liquor, casino-type gambling (including slot machines and pull-tabs) effective immediately; bingo as of 1990, and fairs and the sale of beer at church functions as of 1995. Since that time, church parishes have been required to fund their activities from the collection. (Organizations such as youth groups are still permitted to stage fundraisers to cover their own expenses.)
It's been very successful. Ten years later, contributions were at record levels throughout our diocese, until Hurricanes Katrina and Rita disrupted our economy so badly.
It was Bishop Boudreaux's hope that he would start a trend that would lead to the banning especially of gambling and alcohol sales at church functions, but to the best of my knowledge no other diocese has followed his lead.
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Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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Darlene
Member
| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Pocono Mountains, Pennsylvania USA |
| Posts: | 868 |
| First Name: | Darlene | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Christian, trusting His love and forgiveness |
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Posted: Thu Sep 20th, 2007 08:39 am |
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This is a topic that is of much concern to me. Several months ago the priest made a public announcement that there was going to be a day trip to the casinos in Atlantic City. My heart sunk. This was an announcement made right after the congregation had taken Communion! He said that space was running out and if one wanted to buy a ticket, they needed to do so soon.
This cavalier attitude toward the sacred just irked me. I just don't understand how it can be justified to make an announcement like this right after such a serious and sobering Mass. I don't understand how going to the casinos in Atlantic City can be an "acceptable" practice among Catholics. Not only is there gambling at these places, but prostitutes frequent these casinos as well. (the high class "call girls") And there is drunkeness and pornography. Well, I don't need to go on. I think you get the picture. The whole atmosphere at Atlantic City could be described as "Vanity Fair" as from Pilgrim's Progress. No Christian has any business going there. And from time to time, I have had the opportunity to go and refuse because of the poor Christian witness it would send to others.
As far as beer at church carnavals, I think it is inappropriate. A number of years ago I went to a Catholic bazaar and there was beer being sold and people were drinking too much. How can this be a good Christian witness? How can one defend such behavior. "Give no occasion for sin nor opportunity to the devil."
Just my two cents.
Darlene
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The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. II Corinthians 13:14
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Ali
Member
| Joined: | Sat Jan 6th, 2007 |
| Location: | Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 656 |
| First Name: | Ali | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | JW, finally fully Catholic |
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Posted: Thu Sep 20th, 2007 09:01 am |
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I'm bothered by this, too. Our local church parish's do not do this, but my daughter's Catholic school does.
They have three four big fundraiser's each year. Reverse raffle, Irish auction, Texes Hold 'Em, and a golf tournament. Last year they netted over $50,000.
Alcohol is served at all four of those fundraisers. The reverse raffle is a very nice (and expensive) sit down dinner. So, quite honestly, the alcohol does not bother me there.
Last year at the first parents meeting (keep in mind, last year was my dd's first year in school) one Mom brought up her feelings regarding the previous years Texes Hold 'Em and how it made her uncomfortable to see the liquor and the gambling in our children's Catholick school. I agreed with her, and a couple other Mom's spoke up supporting her, but mostly she was poo-pooed and they moved on. No one wanted to rock the boat and risk losing money over a few people drinking to much. I was very put off by that.
I did help and participate in the other two fundraisers, and yes alcohol was available. It does seem icky, doesn't it? The golf tournament wasn't on school property, of course. But being that the school sponsored it and our name was all over everything, doesn't that lend a bad name to the school if things get out of hand? It's like tempting fate. No, nothing bad or inappropriate happened this year, but IMO it's only a matter of time before it does.
I don't know how to offer a change in this regard. It's so ingrained and seems to be an intergal part of the way society functions.
Ali
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David W. Emery
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Brownsville, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 2074 |
| First Name: | David | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic |
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Posted: Thu Sep 20th, 2007 12:41 pm |
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To all: FYI, I personally agree with your objections to gambling and its frequent accessories, such as alcohol, and have never attended such a function. However, the basic principle that gambling, in itself, does not necessarily involve sin had to be stated by someone.
David
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Ali
Member
| Joined: | Sat Jan 6th, 2007 |
| Location: | Ohio USA |
| Posts: | 656 |
| First Name: | Ali | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | JW, finally fully Catholic |
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Posted: Thu Sep 20th, 2007 01:00 pm |
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David W. Emery wrote: To all: FYI, I personally agree with your objections to gambling and its frequent accessories, such as alcohol, and have never attended such a function. However, the basic principle that gambling, in itself, does not necessarily involve sin had to be stated by someone.
David
I live right across the river from a large casino in WV, which we've visited before and enjoy on occasion. And dh and I are both recreational drinkers. My objection is that you cannot control these occasions when children may be present, and it ends up reflecting badly on the school or church.
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