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Pani Rose
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| Joined: | Fri Oct 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Irondale, Alabama USA |
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| First Name: | Rose | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Ruthenian Byzantine in a Melkite Greek Catholic Parish, raised ... |
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Posted: Mon May 5th, 2008 05:30 am |
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CONCERNING THE BAPTISM OF THE HOLY SPIRIT
Fr. Raniero Cantalamessa, OFM Cap
Preacher of the Papal Household
http://www.ccrno.org/RC.ConcerningBHS.htm
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David W. Emery
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
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Posted: Mon May 5th, 2008 12:11 pm |
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What an important point this well-known theologian and preacher makes here! He begins with a little-noticed doctrine of the Church (the “binding” of sacraments due to sin and the lack of faith) and asserts with considerable force that it is “what is wrong with Christianity” in today’s world:
Now [in today’s world]… our spiritual environment is even worse than the one at the time of the Middle Ages. Not that there is no normal Christian life, but it is now the exception rather than the rule. In this situation, rarely, or never, does the baptized person ever reach the stage of proclaiming in the Holy Spirit, “Jesus is Lord.” Until one reaches this point, everything else in the Christian life remains out of focus and immature.
His exposition also gives us an insight into the real meaning of the charismatic phrase “baptism in the Spirit.” For the first time ever, I am able to make some connections and see it as something other than an extraneous ideology. Now I can clearly link it to what former generations, going back almost to ancient times, have referred to as the “act of faith,” “repentance,” the “second conversion” or a true “awakening” of one’s religious awareness. Cantalamessa himself refers to a “second baptism” or even the sacrament of confirmation in describing the effects of this “unbinding.” This, in my opinion, is a valuable clarification.
But let us note that this “baptism in the Spirit” is a beginning, not a goal. Baptism is, after all, a sacrament of initiation. So it must not be thought of as the Catholic equivalent to the Protestant idea of a “conversion experience.” I would also add that one does not have to be a charismatic to take advantage of the “baptism of the Spirit.” One needs only to respond to the grace of God, given through baptism, allowing the Lord to redirect his life and set him on the true path to salvation.
David
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Pani Rose
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| Joined: | Fri Oct 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Irondale, Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 545 |
| First Name: | Rose | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Ruthenian Byzantine in a Melkite Greek Catholic Parish, raised ... |
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Posted: Mon May 5th, 2008 07:28 pm |
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David W. Emery wrote: What an important point this well-known theologian and preacher makes here! He begins with a little-noticed doctrine of the Church (the “binding” of sacraments due to sin and the lack of faith) and asserts with considerable force that it is “what is wrong with Christianity” in today’s world:Now [in today’s world]… our spiritual environment is even worse than the one at the time of the Middle Ages. Not that there is no normal Christian life, but it is now the exception rather than the rule. In this situation, rarely, or never, does the baptized person ever reach the stage of proclaiming in the Holy Spirit, “Jesus is Lord.” Until one reaches this point, everything else in the Christian life remains out of focus and immature. His exposition also gives us an insight into the real meaning of the charismatic phrase “baptism in the Spirit.” For the first time ever, I am able to make some connections and see it as something other than an extraneous ideology. Now I can clearly link it to what former generations, going back almost to ancient times, have referred to as the “act of faith,” “repentance,” the “second conversion” or a true “awakening” of one’s religious awareness. Cantalamessa himself refers to a “second baptism” or even the sacrament of confirmation in describing the effects of this “unbinding.” This, in my opinion, is a valuable clarification.
But let us note that this “baptism in the Spirit” is a beginning, not a goal. Baptism is, after all, a sacrament of initiation. So it must not be thought of as the Catholic equivalent to the Protestant idea of a “conversion experience.” I would also add that one does not have to be a charismatic to take advantage of the “baptism of the Spirit.” One needs only to respond to the grace of God, given through baptism, allowing the Lord to redirect his life and set him on the true path to salvation.
David RIGHT ON!!!
Yes, it is to become a way of life. See, my way of thinking is if people were healed by walking in the 'shadow' of the apostles, does God desire any less of us in todays world. NO! The apostles coward in in the shadows of the world. Yet after the Holy Spirit fell, then people walked in their shadows. They knew Jesus, they knew everything about him, but until then, they were timid and shy. It is God's power, not mans. Fr. states it so clearly...
"God is Author and Power
The Renewal is a renewal in which God, not man, is the principal author “I, not you,” says God, “make all things new”(Rev. 21:5). “My Spirit--and He alone--may renew the face of the earth” (see Ps. 104:30). From the religious point of view, we tend to view things from a ptolemaic perspective: at the foundation are our efforts--organization, efficiency, reforms, and goodwill. These have the earth here as the center which God comes to strengthen and crown by His grace and our effort.
We must--at this point as the Word of God cries out--”give the power back to God” (Ps. 68:35) because “the power belongs to God” (Ps. 62:12). For too long we have usurped this power of His by managing it as if it were ours, as if it was up to us to “govern” the power of God. We have to totally change our perspective. That is, we have to acknowledge simply that without the Holy Spirit, we cannot do anything, not even say, “Jesus is Lord!” (1Cor. 12:3).
The Baptism in the Spirit is not a sacrament, but it is related to the sacraments of Christian initiation. The Baptism in the Spirit makes real and in a way renews Christian initiation. The primary relationship is with the sacrament of Baptism.
We believe that the Baptism in the Spirit makes real and revitalizes our Baptism. "
I have often thought about the 'binding of sin', especially its being passed from one generation to another. After 29 years in the CCR, I have witnessed such absolutely amazing transformations in the lives of people. Some instantly, but many just steady perseverance believing that what God has started he is faithful to finish. In particular was a middle aged man, who had suffered a crippling decease all his life, and had been an alcoholic. To see this man, set free - literally, - his was my first time of seeing a 'nest of spirits' thrown up. Then to see this man dancing with joy, praising God. For the first time in his life, that he could remember, he was free, he was not using his crutches, he was standing erect, he was free. He never drank again after that day, his life was changed forever. Now it had taken time for him to get to the point of being able to let go of the sin, but at that moment God poured forth his power and Charles was healed. He cooperated with God to loosen the chains that bound him, as the good father states...
"In the case of Baptism, what is it that causes the fruit of the sacrament to stay bound? The sacraments are not magical rituals that act mechanically, without the person’s knowledge, disregarding any response on his part. Their effectiveness is the fruit of a synergy or cooperation between divine omnipotence--in reality the grace of Christ or the Holy Spirit--, and human freedom. As St. Augustine said, “The one who created you without your cooperation will not save without your cooperation."...
Brothers and sisters that is the power of God, that he expects us all to walk in. But, to walk in that power we have to be willing to say yes. To abandon ourselves as such to his Holy Spirit and let him do his thing in us. It is our cooperation with him, to give back to God all that he has given to us through his Son, our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. Life in the Spirit is an affirmation of God's love for us and it is only the beginning for God's Word says in John 14:
8 to be with you always,9 which the world cannot accept, because it neither sees nor knows it. But you know it, because it remains with you, and will be in you.10 19 In a little while the world will no longer see me, but you will see me, because I live and you will live. He came, and He comes to us in his Holy Spirit, the breaking of the Bread, the breaking of his Word, and the security of our Mother his Church, and all the saints expecially the Most Holy Theotokos and St. Joseph.
Last edited on Mon May 5th, 2008 08:03 pm by Pani Rose
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Pani Rose
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| Joined: | Fri Oct 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Irondale, Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 545 |
| First Name: | Rose | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Ruthenian Byzantine in a Melkite Greek Catholic Parish, raised ... |
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Posted: Mon May 5th, 2008 07:34 pm |
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I can't seem to get the Scripture to post from John 14:
12 Amen, amen, I say to you, whoever believes in me will do the works that I do, and will do greater ones than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And whatever you ask in my name, I will do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If you ask anything of me in my name, I will do it. 15 "If you love me, you will keep my commandments. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Advocate to be with you always, 17 the Spirit of truth, which the world cannot accept, because it neither sees nor knows it. But you know it, because it remains with you, and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you. 19 In a little while the world will no longer see me, but you will see me, because I live and you will live.
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setapart
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| Joined: | Sat Jan 13th, 2007 |
| Location: | Austin, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 191 |
| First Name: | Bill | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Born Catholic, Non-Denominational Charismatic, Catholic |
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Posted: Thu Jul 31st, 2008 10:04 am |
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Pani Rose wrote: I can't seem to get the Scripture to post from John 14:
12 Amen, amen, I say to you, whoever believes in me will do the works that I do, and will do greater ones than these, because I am going to the Father.
I recall a message I heard concerning this verse: We may ask ourselves - how in the world are we to do greater works than Jesus did? After all, he healed the sick, casted out legions of demons, walked on water, rasied the dead, etc.
Although miracles similar to these have been performed thoughout Church history, there is another aspect to the "greater works" that Jesus is talking about. It is the conversion of sinners. Jesus had many followers but most of them eventually forsook Him or abandoned Him. In spite of all the miracles many hearts were either hardened or very fragile. But on the Day of Pentecost, there were 3000 souls that were added to their number as a result on just one sermon from St. Peter and this after an event that made the people think that they were all drunk on wine!
It is the conversion of sinners as a result of the Holy Spirit's work in the very core of a person's heart that Jesus may be referring to as the "greater works". After all, isn't that why Jesus came in the first place?
Luk 19:10 For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost."
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But for you who fear my name, the Sun of Righteousness will rise with healing in his wings. And you will go free, leaping with joy like calves let out to pasture. Mal 4:2
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Pani Rose
Member
| Joined: | Fri Oct 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Irondale, Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 545 |
| First Name: | Rose | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Ruthenian Byzantine in a Melkite Greek Catholic Parish, raised ... |
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Posted: Sun Aug 3rd, 2008 03:02 am |
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Setapart - you are true to your name. You have a wonderfuly gentle way of explaing/sharing Scripture. God bless you!
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