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left coast mystic Member

| Joined: | Sat May 10th, 2008 |
| Location: | La Honda, California USA |
| Posts: | 131 |
| First Name: | Marcee | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nondenominational charismatic, Presbyterian, long-time lover of the RCC |
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Posted: Sat May 17th, 2008 05:58 pm |
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| I'm not sure if this is the right forum for this question, but in one of the forums someone said something about CS Lewis believing in the Real Presence, and pointing to Mere Christianity as the place where he discusses it. The poster also mentioned that Lewis adhered to other Catholic doctrines. Can anyone give me specifics on CS Lewis and Catholic doctrine? Also, if someone can help me find the original posting. I used Search (Lewis, "Mere Christianity") but couldn't locate it.
____________________ Godliness with contentment is great gain. (1 Tim. 6:6)
In returning and rest you shall be saved; in quietness and confidence shall be your strength. (Isa. 30:15)
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Steven Barrett Member

| Joined: | Tue Nov 14th, 2006 |
| Location: | Hadley, Massachusetts USA |
| Posts: | 944 |
| First Name: | Steven | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, Episcopal communicant, Baptist, Catholic |
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Posted: Sat May 17th, 2008 06:15 pm |
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Hi Marcee,
Have you seen the Essential C.S. Lewis? It's a thick paperback. Unfortunately I don't have mine at hand to give you more info. But you might want to check in with Amazon or Barnes and Noble. This book has a lot of Lewis' theological and fictional writings and might have what you're seeking.
Happy hunting! Steven

Last edited on Sat May 17th, 2008 06:15 pm by Steven Barrett
____________________ For anybody interested in reading commentary from a Catholic's socially conservative/fiscally liberal viewpoint, go to my new blog at http://www.politicsramble.com/ .
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left coast mystic Member

| Joined: | Sat May 10th, 2008 |
| Location: | La Honda, California USA |
| Posts: | 131 |
| First Name: | Marcee | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nondenominational charismatic, Presbyterian, long-time lover of the RCC |
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Posted: Sat May 17th, 2008 09:36 pm |
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Steven Barrett wrote: Hi Marcee,
Have you seen the Essential C.S. Lewis? It's a thick paperback. Unfortunately I don't have mine at hand to give you more info. But you might want to check in with Amazon or Barnes and Noble. This book has a lot of Lewis' theological and fictional writings and might have what you're seeking.
Happy hunting! Steven

Steven -
I've got almost everything that Lewis ever wrote - even his academic stuff - but since it's not in my computer, it would be hard for me to search through it all to find specific mention of whatever doctrines Catholics would point to as being more Catholic than Anglican or Protestant. I was hoping that whoever did that post that I read might see this one and give me further illumination on the subject.
____________________ Godliness with contentment is great gain. (1 Tim. 6:6)
In returning and rest you shall be saved; in quietness and confidence shall be your strength. (Isa. 30:15)
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Steven Barrett Member

| Joined: | Tue Nov 14th, 2006 |
| Location: | Hadley, Massachusetts USA |
| Posts: | 944 |
| First Name: | Steven | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, Episcopal communicant, Baptist, Catholic |
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Posted: Mon May 19th, 2008 05:26 am |
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Marcee,
That's a good point, but wow, it's kind of hard with Lewis, at least that's been my problem with trying to read his works. He's going to be a mystery for Catholics I'm afraid for years to come. I've even watched once (and I can't even put a finger on when it was aired--but here' s hint, Mother Angelica was wearing her full habit, so it was past 1990!) a show in which Mother was talking about Lewis and why he didn't become a Catholic. I kind of recall it had something to do with his Belfast upbringing. No matter how "English" he became following WWI, a part of him always remained Ulster Irish.
Even though I'm to-the-bone "Irish Catholic," all of us have something that's "native" to us that creates an indelible stamp on our outlook, and perhaps that was Lewis' insofar as any explanation one can give for his permanent Protestant anchoring. As for his "catholic and/or protestant" leanings, I'm more inclined to think he accepted the traditional Anglican teachings of his youth after regaining his faith largely because it was what he was most familiar with to start all over in his yearnings to learn more about God. Tolkein, I believe, is the one most responsible for bringing him back to God, but Tolkein sensibly enough didn't push his friend too far one way or another. Lewis, I simply think, felt just as plainly comfortable with his more conservatively traditional Anglican views as Tolkein remained the same with his (and our) Catholic teachings. But I doubt Lewis' more Protestant writings were any reflection of a desire to demonstrate where he stood on the Prot/Cath church lines. He was far too mature in his theological, philosophical outlook that he didn't need to take that kind of step.
It sure as heck would've upset the Inklings and we can never be thankful enough for the contributions to our culture to those scholarly gents who gathered for a few pints (or whatever) and shared their literary ideas with such total and trusting generosity.
I wish you success on this venture. It sounds interesting. And don't let the fact you might run into a lot of gray areas in Lewis' theological outlook discourage you from digging deeper. If you like solving religious mysteries, working on Lewis should prove even more exciting than Tolkein only because Tolkein's writings are a lot more "clearly Catholic" -- especially the Ring Trilogy. On the other hand, Tolkein from infancy to death was thoroughly immersed in his Catholic faith. There was no interlude, nor any Irish/English cultural factors thrown in such as in Lewis' life.
Happy Hunting! Just don't get lost on your way back to the wardrobe! 
Steven
Last edited on Mon May 19th, 2008 05:29 am by Steven Barrett
____________________ For anybody interested in reading commentary from a Catholic's socially conservative/fiscally liberal viewpoint, go to my new blog at http://www.politicsramble.com/ .
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Dave Armstrong Network Apologist

| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1627 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Evangelical (1977): Diverse Protestant Influences / Catholic in 1990 |
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Posted: Mon May 19th, 2008 11:44 pm |
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Hi Marcee,
I have some information for you, compiled on my C. S. Lewis Web Page (far as I know, the most extensive Lewis links page on the Internet):
LEWIS AND CATHOLICISM
C.S. Lewis and the Catholic Church (book by by Joseph Pearce)
Escape From Puritania (Joseph Pearce; Excerpt from C. S. Lewis and the Catholic Church)
C.S. Lewis and Mother Kirk: Why Lewis was a Protestant (S.M. Hutchens: Review of C.S. Lewis and the Catholic Church, by Joseph Pearce)
Lewis on St. Francis de Sales (Paul F. Ford)
C.S. Lewis and Catholicism (Iain T. Benson)
See also:
http://www.ignatius.com/PressRelease/CSLewisChurchPressRelSept2003.pdf+C.S.+Lewis&hl=en
Lewis was a traditional Anglican. He accepted the Real Presence, I'm pretty sure. He would have also accepted baptismal regeneration. He believed (notably) in purgatory:
Of course I pray for the dead. At our age the majority of those we love best are dead. What sort of intercourse with God could I have if what I love best were unmentionable to Him? I believe in purgatory. Our souls demand purgatory, don't they? My favourite image on this matter comes from the dentist's chair. I hope that when the tooth of life is drawn, a voice will say, 'Rinse your mouth out with this.' This will be purgatory.
(Letters to Malcolm: Chiefly on Prayer, 107-109) Lewis also accepted development of doctrine:
How can an unchanging system survive the continual increase of knowledge? . . . Change is not progress unless the core remains unchanged. A small oak grows into a big oak; if it became a beech, that would not be growth, but mere change . . . There is a great difference between counting apples and arriving at the mathematical formulae of modern physics. But the multiplication table is used in both and does not grow out of date. In other words, whenever there is real progress in knowledge, there is some knowledge that is not superseded. Indeed, the very possibility of progress demands that there should be an unchanging element . . . I take it we should all agree to find this . . . in the simple rules of mathematics. I would also add to these the primary principles of morality. And I would also add the fundamental doctrines of Christianity . . . I claim that the positive historical statements made by Christianity have the power, elsewhere found chiefly in formal principles, of receiving, without intrinsic change, the increasing complexity of meaning which increasing knowledge puts into them . . . Like mathematics, religion can grow from within, or decay . . . But, like mathematics, it remains simply itself, capable of being applied to any new theory.
(God in the Dock, edited by Walter Hooper, Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans, 1970, 44-47. From "Dogma and the Universe," The Guardian, March 19, 1943, 96 / March 26, 1943, 104, 107)
He opposed contraception:
As regards contraceptives, there is a paradoxical, negative sense in which all possible future generations are the patients or subjects of a power wielded by those already alive. By contraception simply, they are denied existence; by contraception used as a means of selective breeding, they are, without their concurring voice, made to be what one generation, for its own reasons, may choose to prefer. From this point of view, what we call Man's power over Nature turns out to be a power exercised by some men over other men with Nature as its instrument.
(C.S. Lewis, The Abolition of Man, New York: Macmillan, 1947, pp. 68-69)
And women priests. . . .
Last edited on Mon May 19th, 2008 11:49 pm by Dave Armstrong
____________________ I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 2000+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
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Steven Barrett Member

| Joined: | Tue Nov 14th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 944 |
| First Name: | Steven | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, Episcopal communicant, Baptist, Catholic |
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Posted: Tue May 20th, 2008 05:37 pm |
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Dave, y'know that old Navy saying, "Women on ships brings bad luck."

Making one an "admiral of the fleet," proves it's more than a sailor's proverb.
Makes you also wonder what Jack Lewis is thinking (or re-thinkig) up there while in Heaven's (pipe) smoking section.
What I want to know is this: Is it a high Anglican smoking section; "no Catholics allowed, except Tolkein." Or, a place for the middle and hazy (no pun intended) and low and lazy Anglican pipe smokers?Last edited on Tue May 20th, 2008 05:38 pm by Steven Barrett
____________________ For anybody interested in reading commentary from a Catholic's socially conservative/fiscally liberal viewpoint, go to my new blog at http://www.politicsramble.com/ .
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Dave Armstrong Network Apologist

| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1627 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Evangelical (1977): Diverse Protestant Influences / Catholic in 1990 |
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Posted: Tue May 20th, 2008 08:35 pm |
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Good question! All I know is that I'd like to spend a few hundred "years" talking with Lewis, after a few thousand each with Our Glorious Lord Jesus, the Blessed Virgin Mary, St. Paul, and Cardinal Newman. 
____________________ I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 2000+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
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Steven Barrett Member

| Joined: | Tue Nov 14th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 944 |
| First Name: | Steven | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic, Episcopal communicant, Baptist, Catholic |
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Posted: Wed May 21st, 2008 02:30 pm |
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And how many moments do you anticipate you'll be sharing with the Rt. Rev'ds Schori and Williams? Probably not many since by that time J.L. Packer, John Stott and Archbishop George Carey will have given St. Peter the goods (even we mere folks) don't have privy to.
On the other hand, seeing what's happened already, and continuing to happen to Jack Lewis' not-so-merrie-olde denomination, I'm not sure we'd really want to know. There's only so much even street-wise Christians can absorb from this definitely not-ready for Sunday morning live relic of a much nobler break-a-way.
Ah, but give me a moment with Winnie, a glass of good scotch or brandy and a Churchill cigar, and I could spend thousands in spendid company if Newman and Wilberforce were tied up!Last edited on Wed May 21st, 2008 02:31 pm by Steven Barrett
____________________ For anybody interested in reading commentary from a Catholic's socially conservative/fiscally liberal viewpoint, go to my new blog at http://www.politicsramble.com/ .
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Dave Armstrong Network Apologist

| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1627 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Evangelical (1977): Diverse Protestant Influences / Catholic in 1990 |
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Posted: Wed May 21st, 2008 05:59 pm |
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And how many moments do you anticipate you'll be sharing with the Rt. Rev'ds Schori and Williams?
About 30 seconds, if they make it. I'm sure they'd be delightful personages then, having been perfected in Christ. But they still hold no interest to me, in terms of conversation.
Probably not many since by that time J.L. Packer, John Stott and Archbishop George Carey will have given St. Peter the goods (even we mere folks) don't have privy to.
It will be interesting to see who makes it and what they're like, won't it? We all need to make sure that we ourselves are in Christ and in good graces.
____________________ I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 2000+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
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BodRod Member

| Joined: | Mon Oct 2nd, 2006 |
| Location: | Apple Valley, California USA |
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| First Name: | Cliff | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Raised an SDA, then Generic Christian, finally at home with ... |
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Posted: Wed May 21st, 2008 08:20 pm |
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Steven Barrett wrote: Dave, y'know that old Navy saying, "Women on ships brings bad luck."

I thought the quote was, "Swinging hips sinks ships!"
____________________ Gratias agamus Domino Deo nostro.
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japhy Member

| Joined: | Thu Apr 26th, 2007 |
| Location: | Princeton, New Jersey USA |
| Posts: | 186 |
| First Name: | Jeff (you can call me "japhy" | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic (Latin Rite) |
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Posted: Thu May 22nd, 2008 03:12 am |
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Here is a quote from "A Grief Observed", the first time I finally realized that C.S. Lewis was not just "a Protestant" but either Anglican or Lutheran. (Up until reading this, I didn't know what denomination he was, I just knew he wasn't Catholic.)
"Tomorrow morning a priest will give me a little round, thin, cold, tasteless wafer. Is it a disadvantage -- is tin not in some ways an advantage -- that it can't pretend the least resemblance to that with which it unites me?" (Chapter 4)
____________________ [Mary said,] "Do whatever he tells you." - John 2:5
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left coast mystic Member

| Joined: | Sat May 10th, 2008 |
| Location: | La Honda, California USA |
| Posts: | 131 |
| First Name: | Marcee | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | nondenominational charismatic, Presbyterian, long-time lover of the RCC |
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Posted: Thu May 22nd, 2008 11:39 pm |
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Dave Armstrong wrote: Hi Marcee,
I have some information for you, compiled on my C. S. Lewis Web Page (far as I know, the most extensive Lewis links page on the Internet):
Dave -
You amaze me! What a great resource you are! Thanks for being faithful to your calling. It's a HUGE help to the rest of us: like having a staircase being put down the hole instead of a rope to help us get out into the light.
-Marcee
____________________ Godliness with contentment is great gain. (1 Tim. 6:6)
In returning and rest you shall be saved; in quietness and confidence shall be your strength. (Isa. 30:15)
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Dave Armstrong Network Apologist

| Joined: | Fri Nov 2nd, 2007 |
| Location: | Melvindale, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 1627 |
| First Name: | Dave | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Evangelical (1977): Diverse Protestant Influences / Catholic in 1990 |
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Posted: Fri May 23rd, 2008 06:02 pm |
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| You're way too kind, but thanks, and all glory to God always!
____________________ I'm happy to offer whatever theological & personal assistance I can. My blog, Biblical Evidence for Catholicism, contains 2000+ papers & web pages (absolutely free) & 16 apologetic books (for sale):
http://www.biblicalcatholic.com/
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