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ecassidy
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| Joined: | Thu Mar 22nd, 2007 |
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| First Name: | Gene | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic to evangelical Protestant to evangelical Catholic |
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 06:44 pm |
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Hi all,
I came across this Canon issued during the Council of Chalcedon in 451 A.D. It is listed as Canon 15:
"No woman under forty years of age is to be ordained a deacon, and then only after close scrutiny. If after receiving ordination and spending some time in the ministry she despises God's grace and gets married, such a person is to be anathematised along with her spouse."
Is this an indication that there WAS a female diaconate in the early Church?
I also came across this canon from the Council of Nicea. It is listed as Canon 19:
"Concerning the former Paulinists who seek refuge in the catholic church, it is determined that they must be rebaptised unconditionally. Those who in the past have been enrolled among the clergy, if they appear to be blameless and irreproachable, are to be rebaptised and ordained by the bishop of the catholic church. But if on inquiry they are shown to be unsuitable, it is right that they should be deposed. Similarly with regard to deaconesses and all in general whose names have been included in the roll, the same form shall be observed. We refer to deaconesses who have been granted this status, for they do not receive any imposition of hands, so that they are in all respects to be numbered among the laity."
The reference to deaconesses says that they are numbered among the laity.
My initial impression regarding these two canons is that there appears to be a difference between a deaconess mentioned in this canon, and the female deacon mentioned in the Chalcedon Council.
One of the sisters in my parish told me that she and others feel that they are doing the work of a female diaconate and they feel there should be female deacons.
Do they have a case?
Peace,
Gene
P.S. I just completed my interview for entry into the Diaconate Formation Program in my diocese. Please pray for me.
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David W. Emery
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Brownsville, Texas USA |
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| First Name: | David | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic |
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 07:21 pm |
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Gene, my understanding is that the word “ordained” in the context of the canon you cite has more the meaning of “installed” as we today would speak of someone being installed as an extraordinary minister of holy communion. It has been explained to me (I’ve not seen any primary sources spelling it out, but the explanation comes from a very orthodox source) that these women “deaconesses” were in fact not ordained clergy but lay helpers who aided in catechetical instruction and in the ceremony of baptism (which was generally by immersion — with the disrobing, towels, etc.). They themselves did not baptize, nor did they fulfill any specifically clerical functions. Therefore, the word “deaconess” represented more the root meaning of the word (“assistant, helper”) than any specific connotation that they were “ordained clergy.”
Anyone who attempts to use texts like this canon to claim that there were in the ancient Church “female deacons” in the same sense that we use the word “deacon” today is, in my opinion, probably guilty of anachronism — applying a meaning acquired with the passage of time to something that existed before the meaning changed.
I congratulate you on your progress in the formation program for the Permanent Diaconate. This is a vital service to the Church, and we can rejoice that there are men willing to take up the challenge.
David
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ecassidy
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| Joined: | Thu Mar 22nd, 2007 |
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| First Name: | Gene | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic to evangelical Protestant to evangelical Catholic |
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 07:36 pm |
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Thanks, David, for your prompt reply!
And for the interpretation of the Canon.
As I write this, I am listening to EWTN Radio at work, and the program is...The Journey Home!
Peace,
Gene
P.S. My wife was present at the meeting, of course, and she was impressed with the three people interviewing us. She is not Catholic, but she does love the Lord and I am praying for her to enter the Church. Maybe one day Marcus will be interviewing us! :-)
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CajunRick
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| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
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| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
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Posted: Sun May 4th, 2008 01:51 am |
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ecassidy wrote: Is this an indication that there WAS a female diaconate in the early Church?
It is my understanding (although frankly I have no proof) that there were female deacons in the early Church, but their sole function was to baptize other women. As part of the baptism rite of the early Church, catechumens would disrobe to full nudity for their baptism, and then be robed in new white garments which they wore for a year.
It would have been improper for men to baptize nude women, so deaconesses were designated. However, they did not have the full "ordination" or abilities given to male deacons.
I admit that I have no proof at hand of this practice, but I have encountered references to it many times over the years. Remember that the term "deacon" means "servant", and the original deacons in the Book of Acts were chosen to wait tables. Their function has developed over time and is, in fact, still in development with a theological discussion currently underway as to whether a deacon can properly perform the Anointing of the Sick and if he does, whether sins would be forgiven. (To the best of my knowledge, no definitive statement has been made on this matter but I could be wrong. I'm not exactly at my best at the moment.)
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
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mg57
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| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Tolland County, Connecticut USA |
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| First Name: | mg57 | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Infant Baptised Catholic |
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Posted: Sun May 4th, 2008 06:19 pm |
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"Deaconesses, An Historical Study"
Fr. Aim Martimort
Ignatius Press
http://www.ignatius.com/ViewProduct.aspx?SID=1&Product_ID=770&SKU=DEAC-P&Category_ID=110
"This book can be considered the last word on the subject of deaconesses. It deserves a wide readership since there is so much interest in the ordination of women."
—Homiletic & Pastoral Review
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ordinary means
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| First Name: | andy | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic in name only, now Catholic |
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Posted: Mon May 5th, 2008 05:16 am |
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Gene,
I am a man surrounded by women. I have in this world three daughters and a wife. My extended family at least locally include my mother and my grandmother and her sister (former nun). I had to put this subject to bed more times than I care to recall. My response is "embrase your roll". The creature God selected to carry out salvations is a women. She is Queen of Heaven and appears to the world to point us to her Son (God). That is a bigger claim than any creature even a priest can make. What more important roll is there?
Andy
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ecassidy
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| First Name: | Gene | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic to evangelical Protestant to evangelical Catholic |
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Posted: Mon May 5th, 2008 01:28 pm |
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Thanks so far for all the comments!
Gene
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Robert
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| Location: | Germany |
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| First Name: | Robert | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | The whole spectrum from black to white, now 100% Catholic! |
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Posted: Tue May 6th, 2008 03:08 pm |
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This subject is coming up more and more and has gone so far here in Germany that a group of women founded Diaconate formation group. The group is not an officially sanctioned institution, but they instruct on the same guidelines used by the German Bishops Conference. They also have the support of some liberal Priests.
They use a number of the well known arguments to justify their call for a female Diaconate. What they are unable to prove is a history of, or the institution of sacramental Diaconate for females.
They use texts like those listed above to “prove” that there were female deacons. What they fail to prove is any form of institutionalized clerical female diaconate, least of all any form of continuity in line with the male Diaconate.
One of the worst arguments they use is to say that 80% of the diaconate tasks are performed by woman, which is used as a basis for the call for institution of the female Diaconate. What they don’t realize is that this 80% is the calling for all Christians and not just the Clergy. My (inane) counter to this claim is that 100% of all pregnancies and births are carried out by women, and I feel very much discriminated against because as a man I can’t bear children.
The next step would be for them to say that Deacons perform 80% of the tasks performed by Priests so why not ordain woman to the priesthood.
____________________
Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect (1 Peter 3:15)
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