 |
| Author | Post |
|---|
Credo Catholic
Member
| Joined: | Sat May 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Greenville, South Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 1382 |
| First Name: | Marsha | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 01:46 am |
|
| I need some help on explaining the catholic approach to suffering. My neighbor across the street lost his wife a few months ago, suddenly, to cancer. He is a retired Baptist minister, a good neighbor and preached the sermon at my father's funeral. Now I can tell he is having a hard time coping with his loss. He doesn't come outside, he doesn't cut the grass or turn on the outside lights at night. He is an interim pastor at a church across town and his duty there is to visit their hospitalized members, but then he just comes home. I want to make some soup and take it to him, but I don't know what to say that would be any different from the usual cliches when someone has died. I have heard some people on the forum explain "offering it up" in beautiful ways. I think that might help him. What is it about joining our pain to the cross? Does someone have any suggestions for how I could encourage him?
|
|
|
Sally Poore
Member
| Joined: | Sun Oct 28th, 2007 |
| Location: | Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 13 |
| First Name: | Sally | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | United Methodist, Unitarian-Universalist, Unity, Roman Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 08:15 am |
|
Hi, there. I'm sorry about your neighbor and the loss of his wife to cancer.
I'm no expert, but I have suffered through many deaths of family members and friends in the past 5 years. My grieving process was actually a big part of what led me to Catholicism. The Catholic Church has the most satisfying and compelling (though sill incomplete this side of heaven) answers of any faith tradition I have been involved with.
First of all, make that soup and take it over to you neighbor ASAP. Don't worry about what you will say. Just refer briefly to what you said in your post. Something like: "I know you must be missing your wife. I've noticed that I don't see you outside as much as I used to, and I just wanted you to know that I've been thinking of you / praying for you, and I brought you some soup." Then wait for his response. He may just mumble "thank you" and take the soup and close the door. He may say something in response to your concerned comments, and that will open the door for what you should say next.
Though I really believe that the Church has wonderful answers to why we suffer and what to do with suffering, it really does not sound to me (from your description) like this neighbor would be ready yet to hear a theological discourse on the Catholic understanding of suffering. So, don't wait until you have a deep understanding yourself before reaching out to him. Remember, he is a Baptist. Your presence on his front porch and the soup kettle in your arms are far, far more important than the words you will speak to him.
If I have learned one thing from my experiences with death, it's this: The most loving, caring thing you can do for someone who is either dying or watching a loved one die is to simply BE with the person. That is easier said than done. You must recollect your own self first before you will be in a good space to undertake this "being with" the other person. (Take some deep breaths, be at peace with yourself as much as you are able, calm youself down in whatever way you can, ask for God's presence, etc.) It sounds trite, but it truly does not matter what you say to your neighbor. Your best witness for Catholic theology is simply to love your neighbor by showing empathy for his circumstance. Don't wait for someone else to do it. You do it, and do it tonight. Read the theology book later. Here is the one I will recommend. It's not an easy read. I poured over it several times before the depth of it all started to sink in. In fact, I cried my way through it, it was so profound: Making Sense out of Suffering by Peter Kreeft (Kreft?). It is hands down the most insightful book I've read on the topic. The author is Catholic, and a philosophy professor at Boston College. Perhaps I'll go dig the book out of my book pile and post a few quotes later today. My best to you. Let us know how your neighbor is doing.
Sally Poore
|
|
|
Sally Poore
Member
| Joined: | Sun Oct 28th, 2007 |
| Location: | Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 13 |
| First Name: | Sally | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | United Methodist, Unitarian-Universalist, Unity, Roman Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 08:29 am |
|
This is Sally again. I just read the forums rules on posting quotes from copyrighted material. It doesn't sound like I can legally post any quotes from Peter Kreft's book. Guess I'll need to figure out a way to paraphrase. Administrators, am I correct? Am I allowed to paraphrase? Thanks.
|
|
|
David W. Emery
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Brownsville, Texas USA |
| Posts: | 2072 |
| First Name: | David | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 08:37 am |
|
Brief (100 words or less), attributed quotes are acceptable under the Fair Use law.
David
|
|
|
Sally Poore
Member
| Joined: | Sun Oct 28th, 2007 |
| Location: | Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 13 |
| First Name: | Sally | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | United Methodist, Unitarian-Universalist, Unity, Roman Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 09:10 am |
|
Okay, Sally here again. I'm going to try this on my own. This is insight gleaned from my own grief over loss of dear ones and also from my readings of Kreft's book, Making Sense out of Suffering.
Suffering (especially grieving over death) is actually good. It is painful. It is heart-wrenching (those are weak words) and it is purely awful. Yet, the worst thing we can do for someone who is suffering, grieving, facing death, etc. is to try to stop their suffering. We tend (because of our own fear and anxiety over death and dying) to want to make the pain stop, to put an end to the suffering. We have good intentions, of course. We don't want the suffering soul to hurt any more. Also, it causes us great pain to watch someone suffer and grieve, so we want their suffering to end for our own self-centered reasons.
Yet, suffering is not really like a bleeding wound, where the answer to is put a tourniquet on it and halt the blood flow. Not at all. You have to let the pain run its course, and you have to be present to the pain and allow yourself to feel it, to experience it. That is the only way you will grow from it.
In 2003, I lost my first cousin to ovarian cancer. Born the same summer, we grew up together and she was like my sister. We were going to grow to be old ladies together--traveling, laughing, enjoying one another's familes, etc., etc. Neither of us ever thought for one second (since we come from a family where the women live to be well into their nineties) that one of us would rather suddenly die at age 48. I was quite literally knocked to my knees. I went through all the stages of grief I suppose, but the only one I clearly remember was the time period where I spent hours and hours sitting alone in my chair, staring out the window and crying and asking God over and over "why" he had taken my cousin away from me.
I didn't enjoy sitting there in that chair and feeling all the pain and agony that I was going through. But I couldn't get up out of that chair, either, even if I had tried to. That's how bad the pain was. It was paralzying, as "they" often say that grief can be. Perhaps your neighbor is somewhere in this paralyzed state today.
In that loss (combined as well with a number of other deaths in a short space of time) I basically was stripped of everything I had previously thought was important. Nothing made sense any more. All my self-assured confidence, my bravado, my pride in being a self-reliant person, my whole outlook on life, came suddenly crashing to the floor. I was naked and quite utterly alone. It felt like being at the bottom of a dark and empty well.
It was the worst and most terrible experience of my life. Yet, at the same time, it was the greatest experience of my life. For at the bottom of the suffering and the pain and the endless tears and profound loneliness, there--I discovered--was God. And through that experience, I learned that out of great suffering can come great joy and deeper and more profound understandings of the meaning and course of our life's journeys. I still miss my cousin. A day doesn't go by that I don't think of her at least once. But, if I had the power to bring her back to earth, I would not do it. Firstly, she wouldn't want to come back. Why would she? She is surely now at the magnificent wedding supper of the Lamb. Who would want to excuse themselves from that Table? And, I'm in a better place now, too. Not as good as the place where my cousin is, but I'm in a better place to get there and join her one day.
Grief is good. An awful paradox, it would seem, but true. It's only good, however, if you let it take you, wash over you, "be with" it. (I should add a side note that seems pertinent here. Obviously, if your neighbor appears to be so depressed that he is suicidal, then he is not dealing with his grief in a good way, and some professional help should be sought.) Otherwise, we do best if we don't attempt to stop another's grief. That disrespects the grieving process. Don't try to "fix it". It probably isn't broken. Just be a neighbor and a friend.
Having said all of that, I will suggest one more book--maybe more for your neighbor than for you. But wait until the time is right to offer him a book, and, of course, read it yourself first. The book to which I refer would be from that great Anglican Christian apologist, C.S. Lewis. Title is A Grief Observed. He wrote it during/after he had a crisis of faith after the death of his wife, whom he dearly loved. Welll, I hope I've said at least one helpful thing here. Take care. Sally P.
|
|
|
Sally Poore
Member
| Joined: | Sun Oct 28th, 2007 |
| Location: | Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 13 |
| First Name: | Sally | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | United Methodist, Unitarian-Universalist, Unity, Roman Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 10:43 am |
|
Credo Catholic wrote: What is it about joining our pain to the cross? Does someone have any suggestions for how I could encourage him?
There is just too much in Peter Kreeft book I referred to earlier for me to pick out one good quote. That book must really be read and absorbed in its entirety. Instead, here is a quote from the writings of St. Josemaria Escriva that might be relate to what you are talking about here. It doesn't completely capture the whole theology of the Cross and suffering, but it's good. I found it in the little booklet entitled, Praying the Rosary with St. Josemaria Escriva, published by Midwest Theological Forum. Quote is from page 23, in the section on the 4th of the Sorrowful Mysteries, "The Carrying of the Cross".
"Carrying his cross, Jesus goes out to the place of the skulls...and they lay hold of a certain Simon from Cyrene...and they make him take the cross and carry it behind Jesus...Little friend, we are sad, living the Passion of our Lord Jesus. See how lovingly he embraces the cross. Learn from him. Jesus carries the cross for you: You...carry it for Jesus. But don't drag the cross...carry it squarely on your shoulder, because your cross, if you carry it so, will not be just any cross...It will be the holy cross. Don't carry your cross with resignation: resignation is not a generous word. Love the cross. When you really love it, your cross will be...a Cross without a cross."
Powerful stuff, isn't it?
Okay, I promise to step aside and let someone else answer now. I've said alot, but my responses are quite lacking, I know, in really getting at what you need.
|
|
|
Credo Catholic
Member
| Joined: | Sat May 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Greenville, South Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 1382 |
| First Name: | Marsha | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 11:15 am |
|
| Sally, your answers will be most helpful, and I appreciate your taking the time to fully explain how you dealt with your own grief process. I will go ahead and take the soup now, but a little later take one of the books to him. He is having a hard time of it. He and his wife had only one child, a son who lives in California, so I know he is lonely. I would just like to share something about the catholic value of suffering. He would probably read a book by C.S. Lewis. Thanks for the help! God bless
|
|
|
sewnsew
Member
| Joined: | Mon Oct 9th, 2006 |
| Location: | Arizona USA |
| Posts: | 842 |
| First Name: | Kim | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | cradle Anglican, Episcopal /Catholic-04/07/07 |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 11:49 am |
|
| When my uncle died my childless aunt had no one close to her ( I lived in town but worked the evening shift, had just gotten married) I tried to be there as much as I could during the day but... Her neighbours were wonderful - they expected her for dinner every night for months- no conversation she came right on time to sit down and left right after dsinner but that helped her through the evening hours, they didn't do anthing out of the ordinary, it was just a family dinner. They in fact were my sponsors when I joined the church. When a spouse dioes at first the couples friends are there for them but eventually they drift back to "couples land" and they widow (er) is left on their own.
|
|
|
Intercessor
Member
| Joined: | Tue Sep 25th, 2007 |
| Location: | Southcentral, Kentucky USA |
| Posts: | 1223 |
| First Name: | Becky | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Southern Baptist, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 04:33 pm |
|
Credo Catholic wrote:
I need some help on explaining the catholic approach to suffering. My neighbor across the street lost his wife a few months ago, suddenly, to cancer. He is a retired Baptist minister, a good neighbor and preached the sermon at my father's funeral. Now I can tell he is having a hard time coping with his loss. He doesn't come outside, he doesn't cut the grass or turn on the outside lights at night. He is an interim pastor at a church across town and his duty there is to visit their hospitalized members, but then he just comes home. I want to make some soup and take it to him, but I don't know what to say that would be any different from the usual cliches when someone has died. I have heard some people on the forum explain "offering it up" in beautiful ways. I think that might help him. What is it about joining our pain to the cross? Does someone have any suggestions for how I could encourage him?
Marsha, I'm glad he has you as a neighbor. Cards are an important way to help others. I especially appreciated those cards I received a month, two months, four months after my husband's death. Finding those cards in my mail (upon returning to an empty house in the evenings) said to me that somebody out there understood that my suffering was only beginning. One dear lady realized that I was not up to reading an entire book. She enclosed very small portions (a chapter) inside each card she sent over a period of time. That was not overwhelming to a paralyzed mind.
In a card one can also offer help with a specific task. One of the hardest is going through the loved one's clothing and personal items. It's too traumatic for most persons to tackle alone. I could not have survived it without my sister. If the minister across the street has no female relatives nearby, you might offer, in one of your cards, to help him with that when he is ready. Remember, of couse, that he may not be ready for another year; and don't mention it a second time.
Here's an example of how important phone calls (made not just once but weekly over several months) can be to the grieving:
(to my sister)
Yes, today was definitely better than Monday. Yesterday was a thirteen-hour
day. It is so much harder to come into this empty house after dark. If I
also have to do it in a really tired state, the bottom seems to fall out of
my emotions. Last night just a very few minutes after my sobbing session,
W called. She was very tender and comforting and showed no sign of
wanting to shake me off. Just a moment after that conversation ended, Mother
called me. I was so glad to hear from both of them. Last night was very
hard.
If you can catch him away doing his visitation, go over and mow his grass while he is gone. You could leave a brief note on the entrance he typically uses, thanking him again for his ministry at your father's funeral and asking him to accept the lawnmowing that day as an expression of gratitude.
If you are willing to include him in holiday celebrations in your home, let him know now that (should his son not be available) he is expected at your place for Thanksgiving dinner and for Christmas dinner. The advance notice is important not just for planning purposes but because the bereaved, in their vulnerability, require time to "try on" the idea of a new way of doing something. It's not a good time for sudden decisions or unanticipated changes. As the holiday approaches, check back to learn how his plans are developing. Be prepared to be gracious about a last-minute change if his son suddenly realizes Dad is alone and enters the picture.
I agree that this gentleman is not ready for theological discussions. Maybe a year from now. Maybe two years from now. Right now he needs TLC and the opportunity to complete the hard work of grieving. While he is doing that hard work, others can focus their efforts on the charity of not making judgements and not taking offense. Here's a note I wrote to one of my late husband's colleagues after I had failed to approach him for conversation in a hallway:
Jim,
I did not mean to appear unfriendly or ungracious yesterday
afternoon in WAB. L and I have always been fond of you
and have appreciated your humor, kindness, and good sense.
I had "screwed my courage to the sticking point" in order to
process retirement/insurance upstairs but feared a conversation
at that moment with a sympathetic friend would cost me my
composure.
You are a good and gentle person and will, I believe, understand.
Take care,
Jim is a kind, forgiving soul who chose not to take offense; he sensed that I was struggling to handle the encounter, moved on, made no demands of me, and mercifully did not condemn me for ungraciousness.
Another example of how impossible it is to know exactly what is going on in the emotional life of a grieving individual-- Here's a note I wrote my mother-in-law about a month after my husband's death:
(to my mother-in-law)
I know how you feel, though, about thinking of things you
wanted/want to tell him and about the strangeness of having
the same thought (he's dead!) again. You wouldn't think it would take
so long for intelligent minds like yours and mine to "realize"
something so straightforward as the death of a son/husband.
But it's as if every little facet of the relationship, every
tiny possibility for conversation/interaction/shared experience
must be faced as one more opportunity to remember and absorb
the loss.
At work I had responsibility for over 700 students and 55 subordinates. My days were often a neverending series of crises. I had to be tough but calm and pleasant. One insensitive subordinate said at lunch one day,
My wife asked me how you were doing. I told her it doesn't seem to bother you any, losing your husband; you just go right on with your job.
He had no idea that upon entering my kitchen in the evenings, I sometimes fell to the floor in a puddle and wailed like a crazy woman.
Withholding judgement and resisting the temptation to arrest the suffering of the bereaved are so important.
Sally, loved your comments. I hope to begin volunteering soon with Hospice and plan to order that book.
I close with a note from my sister. She mentions that she will listen to me.
There is no more generous, helpful gift than the gift of listening. The grieving need to voice all sorts of emotions and anxieties. Blessed are those who have a listener.
(to me from my sister)
My dear sister,
It is so important that you let me be with you as much as possible now. I
know that I can't always be with you, and I know that you have to get used to
being alone, but don't try to do it too quickly. I want to spend time with
you on any week-end that you want me. Some week-ends can be there, some here.
Since C(son) is so far away, you need to be with us when you can. It will get
better, but the first year is going to be very tough. When we lost Daddy, we
had each other, as well as Mom and our families. You can't do this alone.
There may very well be some weeks that you won't make it until the week-end.
In those cases call me so I can take a day off and be with you. I have some
days built up. J(husband) and T(daughter) understand that I plan to spend a lot of
time with you. They love you too and are very concerned about you.
Make a list of things that you need help doing like--cleaning out the study,
cleaning out the garage, catching up on laundry, rearranging furniture, thank
you notes, insurance concerns, etc., and we can tackle a few of them each
week-end.
Call me anytime. I definitely don't have the answers as to how you are going
to get through this, but I can listen. I love you.
K (my sister)
Last edited on Wed Oct 31st, 2007 04:51 pm by Intercessor
____________________
"The perfection of a soul may be measured by the degree to which it does the will of God, and finds its happiness in doing it.... O my God,...the only thing necessary is Your holy will," Divine Intimacy, pp. 15-16 Father Gabriel, O.C.D.
|
|
|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5347 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 10:12 pm |
|
Marsha, I have waited to post in reply to your message to give others the opportunity to post. My perspective is a little different.
As you may know, I spent some time as a hospice chaplain, and part of my job was to console grieving family members. The death of a spouse affects the surviving spouse in ways we cannot imagine.
First of all, there is grief. If the two have become one flesh, then literally a piece of our heart has been ripped from our chest. It will never heal. It will form a scab, but it will never truly get better. The old adage that time heals all wounds is a lie. The wound from the death of a spouse, a parent, or a child never heals. It merely forms a scar and stops bleeding. It's like losing a limb. Those who have had amputations say they can still feel pain in their limb, even though it is no longer there. The grief can be acknowledged, but it must be experienced. It cannot be denied or made to go away. It can be ignored or postponed but that's not healthy, and it will only get worse. Only three things will improve grief: time, tears, and prayers.
Second, there is the loss of companionship. For the first time in many years, your friend is alone. His house is empty. He looks around and sees his wife in every corner. He'll flip a light switch and suddenly remember a time that she turned on the light. Everything reminds him of her, and that feeling will continue for years. He'll open a drawer and see a shirt, and he'll remember a time she sewed on a button. He has lost his lover and life-mate, but also quite possibly his cook, his gardner, his seamstress, his house keeper, his dishwasher, his bill-payer, or whatever other roles she may have filled in their marriage. He is suddenly required to find things he didn't even know existed. He is overwhelmed and drowning.
Next, there is the loss of friends. People avoid him because they don't know how to talk to him. They say insensitive things like "You can get married again". As a minister, he has acquaintances, but the chances are his real friends were their friends, and they don't know how to relate to him as a single person. When he does go somewhere with them, he is the fifth wheel. He probably only knows couples as intimate friends. They are sympathetic, but he no longer belongs in their world.
As a minister, he is consoling people with problems that seem petty compared to his. How is he supposed to empathize with someone who is recovering from surgery when his wife is dead? And yet he has to put on a sympathetic face and pretend to care. (No doubt he does truly care, but his own needs are probably overwhelming him right now.)
And then there are the financial concerns. If she worked, he has lost her income. No doubt he will have massive medical bills to pay. He may have had travel expenses and maxed out every credit line he could get his hands on. Now he's got to pay it all back. How's he going to do that?
At times he feels abandoned. How could she do this to him? Yes, he knows it's not true, but he can't help but feel betrayed sometimes. And there are times when he feels betrayed by God as well. He can't help but believe that he did something to deserve this. After all, doesn't scripture tell us repeatedly of people who paid for their sins with the death of a child?
And he also wonders what he could have done differently. What if he had made her quit smoking, or eat more vegetables, or not bought ice cream, or gotten another medical opinion, or taken her to Mexico for one of those quack "miracle cures"? What if he hadn't gone into ministry and he had made a lot of money and could afford to take her to a top cancer center? None of it would have probably made any difference, but he still thinks it might have.
So the feelings are much more complicated that we imagine. Even those in mourning don't realize the complexity. They just think they're going crazy. Someone's going to tell him he needs to start socializing, that he can't let himself give in to the grief, that he has to let the grief overwhelm him, that he needs to drink himself into oblivion, that he'd better not start drinking, that he shoud see a doctor for anti-depressants, that he'd better not start taking drugs.
And some days he doesn't even want to get out of bed. And some days he wants to stay moving all day so he can't have time to think about his loss.
And every one of those feelings is OK. We all grieve in different ways, and none of them are wrong, as long as we get better. But it takes time. I am 56 years old. If I should lose a leg, it would take me a long time to learn how to walk with a prosthetic limb. It will take him a long time to learn how to live alone. And that's OK.
So what can you do? Care.
Pray for him. Bring him soup. Send him a card. Invite him for Sunday dinner. Offer him a hug. Offer to clean his house or have your kids mow his lawn or wash his car. Shine his shoes. Bring him your leftovers. Think of him. Let him know, as much as you can, that he is welcomed with your family. Invite him, but don't force him. Understand that some days he will simply want to be alone. Tell him you don't know what to say or do, but you really do care. Print this message and give it to him.
Give him a coupon book. Let one represent a home cooked meal, another a car wash, another a hug. You can think of many more. Let your family participate. Put things you know he'll like. Don't be afraid to invite him to a social function at your church. Bring him a cookie. Pick some apples from your tree (or whatever else you might have.) Buy a little extra for him. Cook a little extra for him. And let him do the same for you when he feels like it. But you'll also have to understand and accept that there will be times he will present a coupon at the most inopportune time, but that's when he will need you the most. Go out of your way to honor it.
Tomorrow is All Saints' Day. Assuming that he knows you're Catholic, let him know that you understand he does not share your faith, but All Saints' Day is the feast day for all the unknown saints whose faith is known to God alone, and that makes tomorrow his wife's feast day. Let him know you will honor her on her feast day. Congratulate him because he now has his own personal saint in heaven who will be waiting patiently for him when he approaches the gates. Don't get into a theological discussion. Just let him know you will honor her within your faith tradition. He will appreciate the thought even if it doesn't fit within his beliefs.
You can also remind him that Paul wrote that our suffering completes what is lacking in Christ's sacrifice. Look up the verse; I don't have it handy right now.
There's a lot you can do, but the most important thing is simply to care.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
Sally Poore
Member
| Joined: | Sun Oct 28th, 2007 |
| Location: | Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 13 |
| First Name: | Sally | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | United Methodist, Unitarian-Universalist, Unity, Roman Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 10:43 pm |
|
Wow! Phoebe, Rick, Kim! What awesome comments you shared re. Martha's question on her grieving neighbor. I am going to print them out and tuck them into the pages of my Peter Kreeft book on suffering for later reference and use. The insights and very practical suggestions offered in these posts are simply invaluable! I hope that others on the forum will read them and keep the ideas handy for those inevitable times in life when we must deal with grief and loss.
I am so happy I joined this forum. Just participating in this one posting thread has been so very enriching. Thank you guys for your words.
Sally
|
|
|
Intercessor
Member
| Joined: | Tue Sep 25th, 2007 |
| Location: | Southcentral, Kentucky USA |
| Posts: | 1223 |
| First Name: | Becky | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Southern Baptist, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 31st, 2007 10:46 pm |
|
Rick wrote:
So the feelings are much more complicated that we imagine. Even those in mourning don't realize the complexity. They just think they're going crazy.
Rick, wish I could have come to you for comfort five years ago.
It took me three years to stop feeling "crazy."
Memory loss is another common problem for mourners as well.
____________________
"The perfection of a soul may be measured by the degree to which it does the will of God, and finds its happiness in doing it.... O my God,...the only thing necessary is Your holy will," Divine Intimacy, pp. 15-16 Father Gabriel, O.C.D.
|
|
|
CajunRick
Network Helper
| Joined: | Fri Sep 29th, 2006 |
| Location: | Houma, Louisiana USA |
| Posts: | 5347 |
| First Name: | Rick (& Kermie) | | Gender: | Male | | Faith History: | Lifetime Catholic, Latin Rite |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 12:39 am |
|
Intercessor wrote: Memory loss is another common problem for mourners as well.
There are too many problems to count, magnified by the fact that no one else knows what you're going through. Even those who have lost parents, children, and spouses do not know what one another are going through, because the grieving process is different for each person.
I had a patient who was 100 years old. He travelled to Italy to find a wife, and courted her there for 18 months before he married her. Then he brought her to America. Over the years he brought her entire family to his town. They were married for 68 years. He built their home by hand and before he died, he went through the house and tightened every screw, changed every bulb, glued every piece of moulding, replaced what was broken, and replaced what needed to be replaced. He was a shoe maker, and he prepared her house with his own hands so that she would have no worries after he died. He made it a few days after his 101st birthday.
Her son-in-law called me one day and begged me to go see her because she was clinically depressed. She refused to leave her house, wouldn't let anyone come to visit, wouldn't come to Sunday dinner at his house, etc.
So I went to see her. She told me, "I will grieve my husband for one year. For three months I will not leave my home except to go to church or to buy groceries. For the next nine months I will buy what I need. I will wear black, and I will not participate in any activity that might make me smile. This is how my mother grieved my father, and this is how my grandmother grieved my grandfather, and this is how I will grieve my husband." Her son-in-law, who is Hispanic, could understand that. In his culture, family members draw the grieving into family celebrations to help them get on with their lives.
When many generations of families lived near each other, we learned how to grieve from our parents and grandparents. Today, with our mobile society, we no longer know how to grieve. And we no longer know how to console those who are grieving. It's one of the sad results of our American culture. Our families are ethnically mixed and of mixed faith, so we don't even have the security of cultural norms and faith-based norms to help us. We're on our own.
This is not the case in most of the rest of the world, at least not with the severity we experience here. Since America is a nation of immigrants, we don’t'have the cultural stability in most of the United States that most older nations have. Few of us live within a few miles of our birthplace, where most people in other countries still live near home and family. One of the advantages of my Cajun heritage is we have maintained a lot of the old world culture and traditions, and most of us still live near where we grew up and close to family. The same is true in Hispanic areas.
So we have to help each other. We have to care.
____________________
Understanding is the reward of faith. Therefore seek not to understand that you may believe, but believe that you may understand. - Augustine
Rick Luquette
Luquette Lane
|
|
|
Credo Catholic
Member
| Joined: | Sat May 5th, 2007 |
| Location: | Greenville, South Carolina USA |
| Posts: | 1382 |
| First Name: | Marsha | | Gender: | Female | | Faith History: | Baptist, Catholic |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Thu Nov 1st, 2007 12:44 am |
|
Thanks to you all for the many suggestions. I am amazed at how much we can help others if we put our minds to it. I can tell that each of you has drawn on some personal experience about dealing with grief, so your knowledge about what my neighbor is coping with is genuine. Phoebe, your notes are priceless, a treasure to hand down to your children, it's a little slice of life from their own family history.
My neighbor was the minister of a large church here, and his wife worked as a church secretary for another very large church. During her illness and right after her death, there was a non-stop line of cars coming and going with visitors bringing food. Now the visitors have almost stopped, and I know it's time for us in the neighborhood to take over. So I will take something to him tomorrow with a little note explaining All Saints Day and that this is my way of remembering her. Thank you all so much.
|
|
|
Current time is 04:10 am | |
|
|
|
|
|
